Y510p Ultrabay Graphics card

[TheReciever]

Anyone overclock the 4930mx on v3.05?

 

If so then we can at least confirm for anyone that would be willing to mod the BIOS that it would actually be worth the investment of time to begin with.

[Zwierzak]

I've totally bricked my laptop while trying so I had to wait for a new mobo i wasn't able to find any option that would alleviate tdp limit but I still have to try powercut option from Throttlestop. I think that the 57w power limit is maintained by EC not bios and as such really hard to "crack" - MSI crowd wasn't able to work around it for years and they do have few very skilled bios and firmware modders.

[Zwierzak]

Well I've just collected new mainboard and now I know why other users could have problems with cpu power sections - my old one is earlier model with GTX 750 and it have 3 phases for cpu power supply - 3 coils with 2 mosfets each- new one is downsized, 2 phases with empty spaces for third phase - niceeee, wayyy to go Lenovo. I'm going to check it as it is and if it works I'm going to "correct" that "small omission".

Edited April 12, 2017 by Zwierzak

[TheReciever]

Please be sure to share how you did that, would love to learn that process.

 

Are you referring to the Gray boxes beneath the heatpipes

 

Well at least can pull 4Ghz for gaming

Edited April 12, 2017 by TheReciever

[Zwierzak]

I'm going to post some comparing pictures when I dismantle laptop for mobo testing (probably tomorrow)  - I'm referring to the empty spaces in cpu powersection that is covered by the stripe of tinfoil lined plastic sheet right beside a cpu socket - btw no wonder its badly cooled with something like that on top and no appendix from heatplate for mosfets. To be honest I don't intend to solder missing elements myself - thankfully I have good  electronic repairman 100 meters from my flat - btw would you be so kind and provide me with your y510p schematics ? He might need them.

[TheReciever]

Dude you have the worst timing for your requests lol

 

The laptop is back together and its setting overnight   Takes 4-5 hours for thermal glue to set

 

Preliminary testing is fun though, Pushed 1300 core on the single 755m +100mv offset. Might try for 1350c tomorrow, sad to see 1400c is too much

 

Too bad SLI is garbage and crashes under almost any GPU intensive title I play @stock. (R6 Siege mostly, Coh2 doesnt support SLI)

 

I bridged the gap between the heatpipes in preparation of its use for the CPU exclusively. Ill show pictures tomorrow, for now its time for bed.

[Zwierzak]

No hurry - I'm going to bring my piece of junk to Him on Friday at best, there's a chance hell be able to reanimate my old mobo too. Ill look for those schematics on the net anyway :).

Sleep well

[Charles_Que]

So... I just got the setup running and noticed when I opened GPU-Z that my system only runs at x2 3.0 PCI-E even under load. I saw @Tesla's video that his setup is running at x8 3.0.

 

So I do I enable the x8 3.0 Bus Lanes?

 

P.S. I have the XFX RX480 GTR Black Edition.

 

 

Edited April 12, 2017 by Charles_Que

[TheReciever]

That is very strange, and definitely something you would want to have amended.

 

Maybe there is a game you and Tesla share and can compare results? RX 480 > 470 even if the margin is small so if you end up with lesser FPS in a few games it would confirm that GPU-Z is accurate.

 

@Tesla What do you think?

[Tesla]

Very strange indeed. I would double check if the adapter is properly seated. Mine runs at x8 3.0 under load. it crawls back to x1 x8 1.1 on idle. but that is it. x2 lanes under load would only indicate something unusual is going on.

 

Edited April 13, 2017 by Tesla
correction + screen shot

[Zwierzak]

Heh i still haven't got to replacing my mobo - i plan to take care of it tomorrow - but I wanted to ask about m.2 ssd - what type of interface y510p use? Legacy SATA,  AHCI, NVMe?

[TheReciever]

No NVME and last I recall you never install ssd's over Legacy, supposed to be AHCI isnt it?

 

NVME is just a buzzword though, consumers dont have work loads dense enough to properly utilize it for the most part.

[Zwierzak]

Well with r9 fury and some newer games I just might I also plan to get 2133mhz ddr3 but I'm not sure that they will  be able to work at full speed with standard bios - will see. As to legacy mode most of SATA M.2 ssd use it as default if I recall correctly and some older ones can't be switched to AHCi (i think )

Edited April 14, 2017 by Zwierzak

[TheReciever]

R9 Fury is irrelevant to Storage I/O

 

Games will not utilize NVME to its potential. Even full bore video/picture editing has not yield much of a benefit over a regular SSD as many have found when looking at their I/O traffic. That and overheating controllers makes it a currently stupid buzzword technology to get people hyped into because of the nice looking large file transfers.

 

4702mq supports 2133mhz so I dont see why 4700mq wouldnt. I have some 2133mhz RAM in my other laptop, ill swap them and try it out.

 

As far as I can recall, legacy mode = HDD, AHCI = SSD

 

You cant switch them after OS deployment as it borks how the system reads that storage (vs how it was installed), y510p was way before pcie based NVME. I remember them days, NGFF it used to be called lol. Anyways other SATA m.2 drives are likely skylake and later machines and used for OS and not explicitly cache.

 

@Tesla Can you check how your m.2 drive is installed?

 

2133mhz seems to work fine on the y510p.

 

HyperX 16GB kit operating @ 2133mhz unless I am reading that wrong...

Edited April 14, 2017 by TheReciever
added SS

[Zwierzak]

Well mate two things. From what I know and I have few friends who work in 3d modelling and live video processing NVme can be utilise quite well although far from its full capacity, just like full PCIE3 x16 throughput - which practically is never fully used and yet they are working on and will soon be bringing to market PCIE4 standard. I vaguely recall Bill Gates statement about computers never needing more than 640k of ram

Secondly your knowledge of m.2 working is far from complete. Currently you have 4 types of m.2 SSD disks on the market  - old SATA only which don't use PCIE lanes at all and work in SATA legacy mode only through SATA bus connector in M.2 - most of newer SATA ones which are hybrid legacy SATA/PCIE AHCI and mainboard manufacturers choose which mode will be implemented on integrated m.2 connector, PCIE SSD which don't have SATA lane at all but use PCIE through AHCI controller and PCIE which use NVme controller.  I think you mixed Legacy SATA and Legacy EIDE.

 

About 2133 ddrs, that's good news I couldn't find any solid information about them in y510p (just like I couldn't find much about 4930mx overclocking)  so another 100$ or so will be "well spent"

 

By the way games would probably already use full potential of PCIE3 and NVme if not for limiting influence of home video game consoles which served as a technical clamp for at least fifteen years.

Edited April 14, 2017 by Zwierzak

[TheReciever]

To you I will say the same thing I have said to everyone else.

 

Provide an I/O profile, and back up your statements. Regardless, it has nothing to do with games :/ Bill Gates thoughts are irrelevant in every conceivable way. Utilized and actually saturating in work loads are vastly different, I am speaking to actually what you paid for, which is basically the performance represented by "benchmarks", you'll note none of the reviews actually provide I/O profiles but still mention that consumer workloads will not be of much benefit because the density of I/O for consumers is significantly lighter. We all like to think that just because the hardware is capable that the benefit will be corresponding.

 

 

I could really care less about m.2 standard, its of no real tangible benefit to me as a consumer, more expensive than 2.5" counterparts and larger than mSATA for anything larger than 256GB (@44mm which the y510p is built for)

Especially when I can get a NGFF to mSATA adapter and slap on a 1TB SSD for a whopping 1.50 off ebay. Not to mention overheating controllers causing them to throttle, hopefully they at least fixed that much with the later offerings.

 

http://www.overclock.net/t/1500862/1-single-ssd-vs-2-ssd-raid-0/0_50

 

I defer to DuckieHo's judgement. The thread is old, however the premise is the same.

 

I wont bother with your last comment, its also not relevant. You could also say that you wouldnt have any games to play if the consoles didnt exist, it does not automatically mean that market would just defer to PC gaming.

Edited April 14, 2017 by TheReciever

[Zwierzak]

Well I'll try to get some solid data on NVme usage although it can take a while

Maybe it currently don't have much impact on consumer market but for professional use it can be quite useful - at least that's what I've heard  from people dabbling in such things. I'm not  one of them so I base my views on their experience. As y510p obviously wont have that (I sometimes forget about the age of this laptop) that's purely academical  issue, but my question was motivated by possible incompatibility between implemented standards - from what I can recall at lest some if not most of NVme disks wont run on AHCI PCIe only mainboards and vice versa so I need to take that under consideration when buying one, it doesn't mean that I dream about buying NVme ssd but I've already seen quite a few times how consumer market gain on technology.

 

From what I've seen m.2 can be very useful in y510p as I can get 256gb disk for about 100$ and set a system + some games on it and use sata connector for large HDD as a file repository

Btw I'm grateful for informations regarding M.2 and 2133 ddr3 in y510p

 

About your last statement I don't really get it - PC Game market was quite resilient ad much more developmental and innovative before it merged with console game market but Ill agree its not relevant to our current discussion.

 

And could You explain what for You want to use NGFF to mSATA adapter ? Because if its for DVD/ultrabay then I don't think it would fit with eGPU adapter from Gerald.

 

Edited April 14, 2017 by Zwierzak

[TheReciever]

I never stated that specialized loads may not be able to take advantage of it, but that consumer work loads rarely if ever will. All I have seen is a lot of hype, crushed, by people doing video editing over on OCN, then reselling them because they had boot issues (motherboard issue) then overheating problems on the controller (NVME issue). Its a new product and companies dont iron out these issues before launching them anymore.

 

You'll have to keep in mind that pricing is relative. For me 256GB would end up being more than 300 because of shipping/ import duties. For the similar price I could get the NGFF to mSATA adapter except I would walk away with a 1TB drive instead of 256GB so it just makes more fiscal sense. Despite my bias of m.2, if its cheaper I would still use it for certain, the issues is being limited to 256GB. Some y510p's have a capacitor blocking larger drives as well, I remember this being the case on my first y510p, the current y510p doesnt have on there (which I thought odd, but pleasant.)

 

I actually need to snap a picture of the port because it really doesnt look like an m.2 slot, but doesnt have the screw placement of mSATA either.

 

Gaming in the 80's and Gaming now are completely different beasts. There were certainly no 40-200 million dollar budgets (even accounting for inflation) for any titles in early PC gaming. Even with that said you had fragmentation then just like there is fragmentation now. I prefer todays fragmentation where I dont have to switch my OS just to play a game or use an application, dont need to work around that problem with multi-OS booting or virtual machines. Though I like the idea of Multiboxing, I dont like having that as a NEED for day to day items. People want to hate on console gaming for holding back innovation but without the income from consoles its quite unlikely we would see what we have now.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/252574879948?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 

For the ultrabay SATA port, you can actually use it in tandem with the PCIE adapter. Other users have documented this in another recent thread. Just need a cable solution (which you can also find on ebay or amazon) otherwise a fixed solution might have some problems and your reasoning is sound. I am thinking you can remove the foam padding (or at least a portion of) and also the drive cage might open enough space for another drive, or at least another SSD with the casing removed.

 

I accept this post may be scrambled, I am in between meetings and still getting my morning caffeine.

 

I am probably going to just get a 4910mq in the future though, seems easier to deal with. 4910mq from a m4800 and replace its CPU with the 4700mq I have now and install a 965m 4GB and make my m4600 I have now into a media server or pfSense box. I love rPGA / MXM laptops, can repurpose when and for what ever I feel like

Edited April 14, 2017 by TheReciever

[Zwierzak]

Maybe If I would want to left adapter as it is then I could squeeze msata to ngff adapter also but its very risky - one  careless move and the eGPU adapter pops out which may lead to short circuit in graphic card - I plan to built Gerald adapter in to housing of normal ultrabay graphic card and am currently looking for a  broken one - if I cant get it I'll use my working one. Although using cables to move the connector out of the laptop  is interesting idea that hasn't occurred to me and might be compatible with the housing project.

As I mentioned In my previous post asking about NVme wasn't motivated by willingness to buy one but by compatibility and possible future utilization - as it is the fun with y510p have cost me (memory upgrade including) around as much as I earn in two months time so I'm not too eager to spend more. Still I like a throughput of PCIE m.2 ssd and I probably buy one next month ;).

I was enthusiast of modular laptops for quite a few years  - started with Compal fl92 the Asus g73jh and so on but prices and availability of components are getting bit ridiculous - in Poland1060 laptop costs more than 1080 desktop  used 4930mx 30% less than new 6700k so I've decided its time for a hybrid solution. And I think that next pc I'll have will probably be desktop if laptop manufacturers wont reconsider their price strategy.

 

 

[TheReciever]

There would be no conflict at at all, because its like 6 inches away from the ultrabay, and on the opposite end of the laptop...not sure why your thinking about the SATA adapter next to the pcie socket, which is also a potential solution but not the one I was speaking about. There is no risk at all...Ill be using a riser cable for my project so I can hang the pc on the wall.

 

I know why you asked, but useless for games. Its only more pronounced if a bulk of your gaming is multiplayer, where you have to wait for everyone to load or there is a timer before the start of a game anyways. I mean maybe if you want first selection of your hero in Overwatch or something lol

 

[Zwierzak]

Dont play much multiplayer games but from what I've read Warhammer Total War "likes" NVme disks :). About that mSATA you totally lost me as there is only one such connector on the mainboard right beside ultrabay one (for dvd module). You have also normal sata connector for HDD and mPCIE for wifi card and of course m.2 port. Could you clarify that for me ?

[TheReciever]

No. There isnt.

 

NGFF=/= mSata

NGFF =/= SATA

 

Thats why I was looking at NGFF to mSATA, as its nearly the same size.

 

Has nothing to do with ultrabay at all. These laptops also came with 8-24GB m.2 cache drives you know.

 

You must have a model that did not come with the connector soldered on, which was how it was for the cheaper models. (cheaper as in lower asking price)

[Zwierzak]

Well we totally did not understand each oth ererlier: NGFF=M.2., mSATA is mSATA and SATA is SATA. So from what I can understand you want to buy adapter from m.2 port to SATA or mSATA drive which don't have much sense as you already got one such port in dvd bay which you can easily use with proper cable and maybe with small adapter and a bit of tinkering even without a cable  ;p.  Or I'm still don't understand whole idea with NGFF to mSATA adapter - could you explain clearly what do you intend it for ?

 

Anyway here are photos about what I have mentioned erlier:

Pictures 1 and 2 are from previous mobo with 750m - no m.2 connector and better power section, 3 phases with 3 coils and total 6 mosfets

1:

2:

Pictures 3 and 4 are from new one with 755m and m.2 connector but weaker power section, only 2phases with 2 coils and 4 mosfets

3:

4:

 

What is strange there is only one capacitor on both of them and there should be three as they are very important for proper current stability. Someone definitely overdid with cost cutting.

 

[Zwierzak]

Guess I really don't have much luck with y510p "new" mainboard I've bought works almost ok but... doesn't give picture to laptop screen - I can use external monitor with HDMI but I cant get into bios that way so its useless for eGPU. So I'm back to square one.

[Charles_Que]

On 4/13/2017 at 7:38 PM, Tesla said:

Very strange indeed. I would double check if the adapter is properly seated. Mine runs at x8 3.0 under load. it crawls back to x1 x8 1.1 on idle. but that is it. x2 lanes under load would only indicate something unusual is going on.

 

 

Just did a series of 3DMark benchmarks and the results were more than what @ManyStrongWords had on his video. We both have RX480's. So I guess I could assume that GPU-Z just bugged out on me when in truth I'm already running at x8? Wolololol.

 

Anyway, XFX GTR Black Edition rocks. It's already factory overclocked to 1338mhz. Should I still try to overclock though or is this already okay? Have max thermals of around 75c-77c