naturbo2000

For a long time, ATI (now AMD) used to have the best TV performance, but I'm not sure that's still the case. I expect they're very similar in TV capability (especially digital TV). This isa question best answered on CryEngine forums.

Yes. They probably have only one PCIe power connector when some of the cards you're looking at need two, but the cards should come with convertor cable to work off some of the other connectors on the PSU - - - Updated - - - If other users of the software you're looking at say that a particular card is better, then that statement holds true when considering an egpu (assuming you don't care about driving the internal display), so a 7870 might be the best choice for you. I wouldn't worry about brand unless you're planning on overclocking, but a 2GB card is good if the price is right.

If I didn't want to send the output to the laptop screen, I'd have bought a 7850 myself. IMHO it's by far the best performance for the money of any GPU. I got lucky with my 560ti448 as Amazon sold it at £127 at the time - but a 7850 still just about beats it. - - - Updated - - - You should be good-to-go with the Corsair VS350, the BeQuiet! 350W or the Corsair CX430. Otherwise, I wouldn't go near anything else priced below the XFX 450W I already mentioned (and of those choices, I'd _still_ go with the XFX ) edit - of course I'd actually go for the Seasonic S12-II 430, but reviews point to the XFX being a rebranded version of the same unit.

No need for a soldering iron or dremel that's only for an xbox psu (or similar) and custom enclosure respectively. btw - I scared myself soldering the other day: I fried a fuse on the motherboard of my T420 doing a screen upgrade - and managed the repair! But can understand how daunting it can be. I think all the advice here sums up to: "Get a PE4L, PSU and graphics card of your choice and figure out an enclosure somewhere along the line" - but then we knew that already

If I were doing my setup from scratch, I'd probably use the xbox PSU I have laying around, with a smaller enclosure (but I happened to have a decent ATX PSU spare and a 560ti448 is 210W TDP). The issue in this thread is that the OP wants plug-n-play and not to mess around with a soldering iron and a dremel (can't think why not - that's half the fun ) - that's pretty much the only motivation for a PE4H v3.2 and comes with extra cost and card limitations.

It's probably of higher quality than the xbox itself I've had one RRoD, my brother's had 2, you hear of many more. How many failed xbox PSUs have been reported?

Very true, and I thank you for that. My objection was to the use of x16 as I firmly believe it shouldn't be used when describing _any_ PE4L or PE4H setup (even BPlus are guilty of this). The PE4L has an open ended x4 slot (wired as x1); the PE4H 2.4 has a x16 slot but can be connected at most as an x4 (and beyond x2 is hard); the PE4H 3.2 has a x16 slot but is hard-wired as x1. Any mention of x16 suggests that you have something like the connector inside a regular PC and it's at best only physically the same connector. Especially as davide445 has already stated that his eGPU setup is not for gaming (I'm not sure whether there's anything to be gained from an eGPU for davide445's usage, but that's not my place to answer - I simply have no knowledge of the use case to make card suggestions). That I don't find your nVidia/AMD pairing equivalent is irrelevant, but the choice should be nVidia-only if using the GPU to drive your laptop internal display. It's possible to use AMD, but there's more software setup to do. I'd also suggest using any 250W and upwards PSU will work, I just won't recommend anything low end - - - Updated - - - One other thing about the PE4H - don't get v2.4 for your usage (you can only get PCIe1.1 x1 with your setup, i.e. half the bandwidth of a PE4L). You choice should only be between a PE4H 3.2 if you want the enclosure it comes with or a PE4L-EC060A if you want any other enclosure) - - - Updated - - - Both come with all the cabling you need. PSU has the cable to connect to the SWEX (in the PE4L case), there is no SWEX for a PE4H v3.2

A score which is clearly higher than the internal graphics but not as high as you'd expect (around 20000)? I'm guessing you're using the laptop internal display rather than an external monitor. If so, the bandwidth required to send the image back from the graphics card is what's costing the 5000 points.

Not quite. Firstly I'll explain what the non-Opt means: 1.1 Means it's the same bandwidth as 1st generation PCIe x1 (PCIe 1.0a x1 or the equivalent PCIe 1.1 x1). 1.2 Means it's the same bandwidth as 2nd generation PCIe x1 (PCIe 2.0 x1). This is twice the bandwith of PCIe 1.1 x1. The Opt means nVidia's optimus compression. This is detailed in the first post in Nando's DIY eGPU Experiences. Basically you get data compression between the CPU and GPU so get more performance out of the available bandwidth You may notice that a typical desktop uses an x16 graphics card slot for 16 times the bandwidth of the descriptions above. You'd think that this is a major problem. It's not (or at least not if you're not using the absolute top-end graphics cards). Sure - eGPU is bandwidth-limited, but at PCIe 2.0 x1 with Optimus compression, it's not bandwidth starved. Your X220 with an nVidia GPU gives you the best non-thunderbolt solution right now (especially if you intend to use the laptop display). With a Lenovo X220, you should only consider EC (expresscard) connection. This is PCIe 2.0 compatible and by far the most straightforward way of setting up. Note that a PE4H 3.2 EC060A is equivalent. Yep - you'd need to google image search or similar for any card you're interested in Given the deal I found, I'd pick up a XFX 450W Pro Core at around £35. Yes you only need 300W, but I couldn't find better for the price. Don't forget to add on the graphics card. You're probably talking about 400USD all-in, given you don't any parts lying around and want a pre-built enclosure.

Absolutely. In fact I said exactly the same several times in this thread, but obviously not loudly enough: The graphics card compatability issue is that you need one with the PCI express power on the end rather than on the top. See the spec here, which means you need a card like this one. Any desktop ATX or SFX PSU will connect to the PE4H 3.2. The big white connector block on the circuit board is the standard 24 pin power connector that which you'd normally plug into the motherboard. For a 650ti, you should be just about OK running off a 120w laptop power adaptor as they describe, but you'd be on the limit of its capability. You'll see that they also claim that PCIe 16x video cards don't work with a PE4L - that's just them covering themselves. For a number of laptops there's a bunch of extra work needed (software-wise) to make them work. For Lenovo 220, 420, 520, there is no problem as long as you use the latest bios and don't use more than 8GB RAM.

Yes - I'm only suggesting a case for the purpose of being a convenient enclosure. You can get an egpu up and running without (and it seems many never buy/make a case). Those quoted numbers are for the graphics card in a full system, so it includes some overhead for motherboard, CPU, hard drive etc. You won't be having any of those (unless you're looking to upgrade to a full system), so you don't need one that highly rated. As sgogeta4 states on page 2, the TDP for the 650ti is 110W and the TDP for the 660 is 140W (which corresponds to 9.2A and 11.7A respectively). Giving yourself some headroom, lets say 15A, means that you can manage quite happily on a 180W PSU (at least a PSU that can supply 180W on its 12V rail). This calculation goes out of the door if you plan on overclocking or using the PSU for something else later, but I'd go for a good quality 250-300W PSU (I will not advise on a cheap PSU). What would I get? I'm a big fan of Seasonic power supplies. They cost a chunk of cash, but they're incredibly quiet and you don't have to over spec them to make them last. I've had one fail on me, but it didn't take out any of my connected components and was covered under a 5 year warranty. In my egpu build, I've got a massively over spec Corsair AX650 (left over from my old desktop machine). Why, when I've just said the above about Seasonic? Seasonic make the high end Corsair PSUs and it comes with a 7 year warranty. Being fully modular helps manage the cable mess. Low end Corsair CX aren't made by seasonic But all of XFX's range are, so I'd pick up a XFX 450W Pro Core at around £35 (having just said you only need 300W ). Single 34A 12V rail. Use it in a desktop machine later on. A final word of caution. The obvious PSU for an egpu build is regular ATX, but many of the smaller cases will not take an ATX PSU without modfication. The Sugo SG05 for example only takes the smaller SFX format. You may look to pick up an SFX PSU in the first place, but you might need an adaptor bracket depending on your final enclosure. So the final decision of what to do about an enclosure does impact what to do about a PSU.

Correct. I've just realised what you mean by amateur. You never installed a graphics card (and definitely never put together a PC from scratch). That's not a problem, it's still easy, but means that I have to be a bit more complete in my explanations. A case has no PCIe slot, only backplates for physical mounting. I'm only suggesting a mini-itx case for the convenience of physically mounting the graphics card and PSU. You can make a smaller enclosure with some DIY skills, or leave all the components on the desk (or use a PE4H 3.2). The mini-itx case is the easiest way to a small, tidy solution. It is overkill for what we need. A mini-itx case would normally house a mini-itx motherboard (which in turn houses a CPU and memory) which typically has a single PCI express slot which you can mount a graphics card in and screw to the backplate in the case for stability. For an egpu setup, there is no need for a motherboard in the case - your motherboard is under the keyboard in your laptop. But you do need something to plug the graphics card into for it to communicate with your laptop. That's the PE4L. So you've got a PE4L to take care of the electrical signal connection from the graphics card and a case to physically screw the card to. You then need to power the PE4L and graphics card. This is easily done with a regular desktop ATX power supply (or SFX in some of the smaller cases mentioned). You take a regular floppy power connector from the PSU to power the PE4L and provide a small amount of power over its pci express slot. And you take a regular PCI express power cable from the PSU directly to the graphics card. There's one additional gotcha which is that the PSU won't turn on without being connected to a motherboard. A regular motherboard has its power supplied by a 20 or 24 pin connector from the PSU and is connected to a switch on the fron panel of the case. When you press the power switch on the front of the case, the motherboard shorts two pins of that 20/24 pin connector to tell the PSU to fully power up. In an egpu setup, you connect the SWEX adaptor to this 20/24 pin connector to tell the PSU to wake up. Unfortunately you can't use the front panel power switch, but you can either make the SWEX accessible to turn it on and off, or leave the SWEX always-on and control the power to the PE4L and GPU via the primary power switch on the back of the PSU (as I do).

I just look at the back of the case: http://images.tweaktown.com/content/3/7/3726_09.jpg On the right hand side is a single slot. The gap in the bottom is where a motherboard would normally go. There is no slot in the case. The PE4L that you connect the bottom of the graphics card (with most of the connector overhanging) is the slot. You just need to connect a floppy power connector to the PE4L, a PCIexpress power connector to the graphics card, the SWEX adaptor to the PSU and you're good to go. Note that you can't use the case front power button to turn the graphics card on, but you can use the PSU switch on the back of e.g. the SilverStone SG05 to do so.

You definitely see some benefit from using a card faster than a 460. BUT they don't perform as well as they would on a desktop. From reports in the main eGPU thread, it seems that a 650 isn't bandwidth limited across even a PCI express 1.0 x1 connection (!), but cards above that certainly are. That does not mean that a 680 performs the same as a 650. It means that an egpu 650 performs the same as a desktop 650, but an egpu 680 performs much slower than a desktop 680 (but still better than a 650). So the issue of using something more than a 460/560 ti is that you are spending a lot more cash for less performance than you'd like. I can't answer that question. You need to find what desktop users of the app you use find as the best tradeoff. tbh I'd be surprised if there was much benefit going above a 650, but that's blind speculation. If other users find a 680 useful, then I'd say get the 660 as a sensible trade-off I can't help with specific cards, the description sounds sensible (like a reference design). Power questions have been answered already - what matters is the 12V current.

The thermaltake is nice and small, but if you want a no-modification install, it will only take a single slot graphics card. You definitely can't get a single slot 660, and I can only find one reference of a single slot 650ti Colorful 650ti. Even most 650 non-ti's are dual slot. The included PSU can drive 180W on the 12V rail, so should be good for any single slot nvidia card. You would need a molex to pci express power adaptor, but most cards come with these. the length of the chassis looks good for any single slot card as well: PSU rating So with that chassis, the limitation is to use a single slot card that's no taller than the backplate. I think this also implies the power connectors need to be on the end of the card and not the side. The Silverstone case will take any dual slot card up to 10" in length. Most cards you're looking at fall into this category, unless they've got special cooling (like a Asus Twin Frozr). The 300W PSU should be sufficient with 14A and 16A on the 12V rails.

The performance increase is not as good as if you used the same graphics card in a desktop PC. It's vastly better than any sensibly priced laptop (and if you use the trackpoint on your x220, then there genuinely is no alternative). It's quite limited if you're using the laptop internal display, but _still_ worthwhile even then. There are apparently other adaptors available, but the PE4L-060A works well and works at Gen2 speed (I'm now looking into trying a PE4L-200A for my particular needs). I couldn't find any european sellers, so I got mine from redrontech on ebay (search for item 181101262743) and delivery was speedy (less than a week I think). It seems BPlus are listed directly on AliExpress, but I've never used them: Aliexpress.com : Buy PE4L EC060A V2.1b Adapter from Reliable ExpressCard to PCIE suppliers on Shanghai Bplus Electronics Technology Ltd. I picked up a cheap GTX 560 448 core and am very happy other than the noise it makes! (to the extent that I've now watercooled it: http://forum.techinferno.com/diy-e-gpu-projects/2109-diy-egpu-experiences-%5Bversion-2-0%5D-82.html#post42019 for which much smaller than an elite 120 would be a problem ) From anything I've read, a GTX 560 448 beats a GTX 650ti. I would take a refurbished GTX 460 over a vanilla GTX 650 (a 650ti is a closer match) - AnandTech | Bench - GPU12 Case-wise, you could just aim for a PE4H-3.2 (ebay item 170990045067), but you have to figure out getting power to it and worry about graphics card compatability. Otherwise look around at other mini-itx cases which can take a graphics card, or build something custom! A silverstone SG05 might work, especially if you need a PSU anyway.

With an X220, Running 8GB RAM, your life is quite easy. You need: The latest Lenovo bios for your machine (this fixes any TOLUD issues, so you don't need the Setup app). A PE4L-060A express card adaptor (with SWEX), an easy eBay find in the uk, shipping from China A graphics card. Go with nvidia if you want to use the internal display. The latest desktop drivers for that card A desktop PSU A mini-itx case makes an easy enclosure. I have a cooler master elite 120. Stick it all together, power up the gpu before the laptop, install desktop drivers, enjoy!

I was going to suggest that it might be a bios setting, but as you state, GPU-Z sees 2.0 x16. 3DMark06 isn't a good example as it's not being limited by the available bandwidth, but 3DMark11 might be a better indicator. You suggest other people are getting much higher scores for similar hardware, but I don't see any 550ti scores on the first page other than for 3DMark06 and your scores before and after beat those. Where are you seeing a better 3DMark11 result (GPU has vastly more influence than CPU on these scores? Of course the worst outcome might be that a 550ti can't actually make use of more bandwidth than x1 1.0 (!)...

I've gone a step further and watercooled my gpu, as I couldn't stand the racket of it and found a good price on a Corsair H40. Not silent, but a vast improvement. It's allowed me a small overclock without driving the noise up, to a 3dmark11 graphics score of 5513 (external monitor)

I can't comment on whether the Pentium CPUs are sufficient for Optimus, but I know for certain that you do not need Optimus prior to the egpu to get it working correctly. My T420 has an i5-2520M CPU and no dedicated graphics. With a 560ti448 and the latest stock nVidia drivers, Optimus is working correctly. I would expect that the SB Pentiums would work fine, but it will come down to what nVidia has chosen to support in their drivers.

I have a reasonably new T420 which I bought explicitly for running with an egpu - a 560ti448 on a pe4l 2.1. It already had the most recent bios, so has literally been plug and play. Connect it all up, power up the graphics card then cold boot the laptop. Once into windows 7, the card was spotted so I just download the latest geforce drivers from nvidia and was all done. Optimus works if using the laptop screen is important to you, but an external monitor allows better performance. Gaming on a 1680x1050 screen, I've yet to see bandwidth issues. I haven't played around with hot plugging it - I tend to hibernate my laptop and it absolutely cannot cope with coming out of hibernation with a hardware change.

We should, especially as I went to very little effort to make my system tidy :-) (T420 with an external 560ti448 in a CoolerMaster Eilte 120). The missus really doesn't mind my gaming PC now that it's not housed in a TJ09. Setup is clean and the laptop itself is mobile, but I might aim somewhere else if I wanted the whole system for LAN parties etc. (though even then Optimus would mean there's no need to take a monitor). I'll make sure I take a piccy real soon.

Thanks Nando for all the great advice in this and the previous thread. My T420 and 560ti 448 via PE4L 2.1 is working perfectly (4300 on 3dmark11 using internal display). I've got one tiny snag though. Having housed the GPU and PSU in a mini-itx case (cooler master elite 130 advanced), I find that the 60cm captive cable of the PE4L is just a little too short, so I'm looking for a way to improve that. 1m might just be OK. 2m is probably perfect. I know that it's supposedly available with a 2m cable, but not obviously to the UK. Has anyone found a express card extender, or resoldered a different cable for their PE4L? I'd like to avoid the latter, but it might be the best/only option.