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batyanko

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Everything posted by batyanko

  1. Whether you need to mod your cooling would depend on what your temperature goals are, and what luck you have with the quad-core you buy :)) You may notice from recent posts that people get quite diverse temperatures, probably depending on silicon lotto, i.e. the inevitable random variance in production quality. Generally you should be alright with short bursts of max CPU load, while max loads for more than a few dozens of seconds will lead to heat accumulating, temps rising and core speeds throttling to various extents, depending on how bad temps are. My personal opinion is that if you have a good use for multi-thread performance, you will get quite an improvement over any dual-core, even if you cut turbo speeds altogether. Now the question is whether you really need that multi-thread performance. Those third gen dual-cores are quite decent performers for day-to-day tasks, even by today's standards. The extra money for a quad-core would be worth only if you need the extra CPU cores for productivity stuff like video editing or compiling large software projects. Cutting compile wait or rendering wait in half makes good sense, but usual day-to-day tasks rarely find use for more than two i5/i7 cores.
  2. Does it go really quickly to 103°C, like in a few seconds? If so, chances are there is a problem with the contact between the CPU and heat sink, that is, the two surfaces not completely stuck to one another. This might be because of them not being parallel, for example. If it fits well, the paste will be nicely squished down to a transparently thin layer. To test for something like that, you might want to turn the laptop upside down, remove the heat sink and put some heat sink from an old broken videocard or a desktop CPU. This way you can put it on the CPU manually and make sure the heatsink sticks flat on it (you will feel it, it sticks with a kind of a vacuum). This way you can see if the difference between the 2620m and the 3820qm temps are still so drastic (which in my opinion shouldn't be the case). Meanwhile you can detach the 2570p fan and direct it to the new heat sink, even though a large desktop heat sink would cope passively for some time. Or you can try and see what happens if you put a thermal pad instead of paste - pads are made to fill the gaps when the heat sink doesn't fit perfectly. Just make sure not to turn the laptop on without any cooling attached, though that would be a good way to see in practice how it goes from 20 to 100 to full throttle in mere seconds :)) (done that too though...) Otherwise I've played with copper shims too - they are usually handy to replace a crappy thermal pad. Otherwise they make little difference if the heat sink fits well directly on the CPU.
  3. Dunno, I might well be measuring it wrong... Temperature sensors on the CPUs are supposed to have a few degrees of variance, but silicon lottery / binning should be on your side because you got a more expensive model :)) Otherwise I have a custom bottom cover that leaves quite a big clearance under the cooling, but neither this nor the 2560p heat sink should make as much of a difference, too. If you use proper paste and a stock heat sink, you pretty much have the same thing. Apart from that I am running Linux Mint, which in my opinion shouldn't matter much either. Anyway if you find it interesting, you might wanna try and see if you get same results under Linux - you only need a spare 2+GB USB memory stick to boot a live Linux Mint. Just download the latest ISO, then install it on the flash drive with something like YUMI, for example: https://www.pendrivelinux.com/yumi-multiboot-usb-creator/ When you boot into the live Linux Mint desktop, open two terminals (one of the icons visible on the lower left). In the first terminal enter the following to show live temp stats ("watch -n 1" makes the "sensors" command to refresh every 1 second): watch -n 1 sensors And in the second terminal run the following two commands to install and then run "stress" - a small program that stresses your CPU (-c 8 is for 8 threads): sudo apt install stress stress -c 8 So you got pretty much the same testing setup that I have :)) I do this live USB routine with most old PCs I refurbish, so I can see if the cooling is working properly. GPU clock seems to me not to be hardware-locked to the CPU clocks - in Linux I can set max GPU frequency to anything between 350 and 1250 MHz without touching the CPU. If you are lucky, you might find some tool to do that in Windows XP as well (without setting a general power plan). If you are getting simultaneous 4-core clock around 3500MHz, this should already be maximal performance of the 3820QM. The turbo of 3700MHz is only for 1 core at a time, at least according to specification: http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Core_i7/Intel-Core i7-3820QM (PGA) Mobile processor.html You might be able to do some overclock if what @istinnstudio mentioned about those BIOS mods is doable, but I guess we got more than enough heat to deal with already xD About the temperatures you want to achieve: I think it is quite unlikely that your CPU will fry any time soon even if it runs around 80-90 C most of the time. More likely would be some damage to other components near the processor, like the motherboard or some plastics, and that only in mid- to long-term future.
  4. Getting 103 degrees sounds way too high even for this kind of processor, and even if you live some place hot... If we are talking about CPU loads alone: at 100% CPU stressing I hardly get above 90 C with my 3720QM with 8 threads x 3400 MHz, 31 C ambient temerature. It goes to 87 C in about 25 seconds, then starts throttling a bit, maintaining the temperature around those levels. Real internet usage like a 1080@60 YouTube video only reaches about 65 C. Currently using stock 2560p heat sink. So you might want to check how your Ihtel HD graphics is being clocked/utilized under Windows XP, granted there are tools to measure that. I found out only recently that the Intel HD 4000 graphics can produce remarkable amounts of heat, that is, if you stress it right, or maybe if Windows XP keeps it at 100% clock (1350 MHz or so) for no good reason :)) After running some modern 3D games (something I do very rarely xD) and comparing with other stress tests, I noticed that serious 3D tasks can push temps well over over 90 C in just seconds. It seems that the GPU can utilize the rest of package (CPU+GPU) power consumption up to 45 watts quite quickly; otherwise consumption only reaches around 40 watts if CPU alone is stressed, as others on the forum have already noticed. BTW I like the idea of a heat pipe leading to an aluminium sheet for cooling. I was considering something like that recently, since I am using a bottom cover made of metal anyway.
  5. Regarding an alternative to the 2570p: I have a 13.3 Thinkpad E330 lying around, that model might be an option for you. It feels quite light for its size and supposedly supports IvyBridge quad-cores and mSATA. Maximum RAM was 16GB if I remember well. Furthermore it seems to run pretty cool and silent. However I find the touch-pad to be just plain awfully bad... Also be careful if you are replacing the battery, Lenovo has imposed some strict limitations on the model and a battery from an E320 just won't work. If you really consider buying one, just drop me a line so I can test it with the 3720QM. But anyway I would rather stick with the 2570p if I were you.
  6. I would also be interested to know more on that. It is kind of incomprehensible to me how two processors built using pretty much the same technology can have different power efficiency, apart from production quality variations. For example I had a Core-i3 2120T for sale and some guy wanted to use it to *upgrade* a Core-i3 3220, expecting to get better power efficiency out of the "T" model, even compared to the 3220 clocked at the same frequency. I mean, how do you figure that, SandyBridge being more efficient than IvyBridge? He expected the "T" model to have some secret ultra-efficient voltage tweaks, but come on... Otherwise I have some Linux turbostat watt readings from my 3720QM for you, maybe you can compare these to yours and consider if it's worth the effort: First I set the frequency to 2800000 (that's about the maximum quad-core clock of a 3612qm, right?) using sudo cpufreq-set -r -g powersave -u 2800000 Then I run the following to get the running frequency and Watt readings, sudo turbostat -i1 -d and finally the following to stress the cores: stress -c 8 At this setting, the actual frequency tends to vary around 2700 (+/- 50) MHz, probably due to missing 2800 MHz step. The reported PkgWatt varies between about 23.70 - 25.50 Watt. Now what was interesting for me to notice: if I run a glmark2 3D benchmark simultaneously, PkgWatt will approach 45 Watt, even with CPU core frequencies limited to 2800. That is, I couldn't really limit the total Watts of the processor *including* the GPU. I read somewhere that you can limit the GPU frequency using intel pstate settings, which can supposedly limit the whole processor consumption, including the graphics core. However I don't know how to use these Finally, please do let us know of you find a way to control fan speeds on Linux. I have tried that on different laptops, absolutely no success so far...
  7. Hey guys, I wanted to bring back the PSU/charger topic back a bit Have some of you 2570p veterans had experience with a 65W power supply? The thing is, I switched from 90W to a 65W about a month ago, since the 65W piece weighs some 100+ grams less. So far the charger doesn't get *that* warm even at full load, and I didn't notice any drop in performance (running a Core-i7 3720QM at 3400Mhz, 2x240GB SSDs in RAID-0, Linux Mint). Am I missing something? Only thing that I am not using a battery at all, is that what makes the whole thing possible?
  8. Looks like a really compact and powerful machine, and the one on the pic is supposedly the Core-i7 variant. However, it seems much more limited, that is, if you intend to play around with the kind of upgrades mentioned for the 2570p: The mainboard in 2170p seem to use BGA1023 socket - that is, CPU is soldered to the motherboard. Also there is no DVD device, so there is hardly any place for a second HDD/SDD. Otherwise a pretty awesome machine, especially if you can get it cheap.
  9. invait53 this looks really interesting, so you connect SSD to Slimline-SATA and HDD to Bluetooth port, right? To be honest, I really don't get it how you connect SATA to that bluetooth thingie :)) Btw. it was good to know that you can get +5V from the Mobo in this way, I could use that for my extra cooler instead of occupying USB ports. How did you know that there is +5V at that exact spot?
  10. Nice machine you got there... Regarding that keyboard - the aliexpress one I currently doesn't quite have the same quality as a genuine one. Keys require a bit of effort pressing. Now about the CPU: Do you at least get access to BIOS / boot options menu with the 3740QM? If not, this should have little to do with the OS. Anyway if you want to be 100% sure, you can try with a live USB-stick running Linux, for example. It is quite easy to make one, for example using Rufus: https://rufus.akeo.ie/ . Otherwise the computer should be 100% 64-bit compatible (heck just about any PC from the last 10 years is 64-bit-compatible). Probably some Microsoft license thing. One thing I didn't find in your post - did you get yourself a 90W power supply? According to older posts, you cannot even boot running a 45W CPU without one. If it doesn't get to boot or show BIOS, there should be a compatibility issue or a defective CPU. I cannot really imagine how the former is possible - maybe if you got some custom model 2570p or something. If nothing else works, I would try the CPU on another Ivy-Bridge laptop running some Pentium B*** or Core CPU. Should normally run straight off the box. Please keep us updated. shikyo, if you manage to fit that fan in there, that will be one kick ass cooling solution :)) Really cool indeed that you can trim all those part to make them fit. Just be careful with those heat pipes, those repair shop guys stressed that a lot when I was looking at some old heat sinks (and these were the optimistic repair guys, the others were mostly rambling about how you cannot add cooling to a laptop, because, you see, it is not made to have additional cooling :)). So, supposedly there is quite some danger while bending / working with the copper pipe, because the tunnel inside is very narrow and may become congested, blocking the circulation of the cooling gas inside. Or of course if there is a breach, the gas will just go away and heat transfer will be much weaker.
  11. If you find a more powerful fan that fits there, that would be quite interesting to know. Maybe something maxing at 0,5 A or more, I imagine the motherboard should at least be able to supply 0,5 A. With the additional copper you are totally right that it just absorbs the heat without necessarily dissipating it faster. But anyway I find that to be of big advantage for day-to-day usage - the CPU takes just a few seconds on 100% load for usual tasks, like loading a website or similar. The extra copper absorbs the extra heat just fine and dissipates it later, when the CPU is idle. Otherwise it would be hard to really lower the temperatures without another fan, or tons of additional heat sink real estate. For example you can have a look at that video card heat sink that I tried (4-5 posts ago, first pic) - that was one HUGE heat sink, having maybe a total real estate 2-3 times the area of a laptop heat sink. And yet it performed worse than my current setup with 2nd fan (second pic), lowering max temperatures with about 6-7°C vs. 11-15°C.
  12. My 3720QM would fit and run straight away on the place of the old 3210M, I think it is as close to 100% as you will ever get. These 3.-gen processors seem to be quite freely interchangeable, I did a similar job on a Lenovo E330 laptop as well, the BIOS recognized the new CPU automatically. Worst case scenario would be having to update BIOS (I had just updated mine on the 2570p). BTW I like that copper plate you put there, looks like a nice base for additional cooling. Since you can machine the copper parts, you can find yourself some longer screws and replace the original 4 ones to fix the new cooling directly on the old one. I used thermal glue to fix mine, but it's a messy job.
  13. Hey people, I wanted to share my modifications on a 2570p I bought recently. I got most of the ideas from this thread, so I thought it should be common courtesy to at least share the result. To begin with, I used a second hand, kind of bare-bones 2570p for around $60 that had no battery/charger/RAM/HDD. That was alright because I would have to replace most of that stuff anyway. I went for 2x 240GB Patriot Ignite SSDs in RAID-0 (software setup on Linux Mint), 16 GB DDR3-1600 and a Core-i7 3720QM. No eGPU needed here, as I currently need performance for Android development. Now what might be interesting here is the cooling mod I did for the 3720QM. The processor runs all cores quite nicely at 3400 Mhz, but temperature reaches 87°C in less than a minute and cores start falling to 3300 or 3200 Mhz. Actually not that bad if you only need short bursts of performance, like occasionaly compiling small Android projects. However I wanted to lower those temps at least a bit. I put the laptop upside down and started experimenting, sticking various old heatsinks to the CPU heatsink with some MX-4 thermal paste. Though these temporarily lowered the temperature, it eventually continued increasing as the heatsink heated up, going up to 87°C and throttling down. I could achieve some lasting results using the radiator of an old graphics card, but that was hardly a practical laptop mod, as you can see on the pic. So I decided to try an fix some kind of active cooling which is slim enough to enable the laptop standing on its bottom :)) First I tried to fit a small 100mA-fan directly on the CPU heatsink, but that didn't change the heat dissipation either. However I had ordered myself a laptop fan from Aliexpress for around $2 in the meanwhile, and that one blew a whole lot stronger (I guess it uses up to 0.5 A at 5 Volts). Next thing was to buy myself an old heatsink from a local repair shop and fit it on top of the old heatsink. And here is what came up from that: Having a separate heatsing and fan actually allowed me some flexibility to fit the whole thing on the chassis. You will notice that the fan is on the "wrong" side of the radiator. I put it there to avoid interfering with the other fan intake. With the fan connected to a USB-Port, the CPU now runs a whole 11-15°C cooler than with the original cooling (tested at 3200Mhz to enable comparing with standard cooling). At 3400 Mhz x 8 cores, temperature would stabilize at around 85°C (room temperature around 20°C). Next step was to fix the whole think on the chassis, so that it doesn't fall off. Note that the wire-thingy fix wasn't quite successful, so I decided to use Arctic Silver Alumina Adhesive. Anyway I didn't expect to manage any better cooling solution than this, so a permanent glue was fine. And the final step was to fix some kind of bottom cover to protect the components while carrying (did I mention that the bottom cover was missing in the first place :)) bought myself some large loudspeaker cover for $4, which was made of some rather soft metal, which allowed me to cut it at the right places by bending. It was quite a tedious work, to be honest, but I finally shaped it to the needed form. It happened to fit quite well, using several cable ties to fix it with the chassis. Some day I might take the time to sand the rest of the black paint/foil, which turned out to be quite a hard job. Also it would be nice to replace the duct tape and white carton-thingies with something better-looking.
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