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Prema

CLEVO@COMPUTEX 2016

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Not for me...all i care about is the 120hz, IPS would be nice but at this point I cant wait any longer. Wish i did not know about techinferno/NBR...then i could just buy a p870 today be happy in my ignorance of the better stuff around the corner lol

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Yeah, I think IPS is way overrated personally. Nothing wrong with a good quality TN panel at over 100Hz. I've had both TN and IPS and I just ordered two 21.5 inch monitors on Amazon today. I could have had IPS for $25 each more and I'd rather spend the $50 on something else. Now, a crappy TN... definitely not good. I don't hate IPS, but I'm not interested in paying anything extra for it.

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20 hours ago, Prema said:

The FHD 120Hz is TN with 5ms response time...there are rumblings about an IPS alternative but haven't seen anything concrete.

Prema are you kidding about TN. Are you?

 

I found info that ASUS rog (so maybe clevo too) 120hz will be from AUO AHVA which is faster than IPS while having better colors than TN and being nearly as fast...

http://us.hardware.info/reviews/6016/9/acer-predator-xb270hu-review-first-144hz-ips-monitor-test-results-response-time-and-input-lag

 

Laptops AHVA diplays

Edited by Legion

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6 hours ago, Legion said:

Prema are you kidding about TN. Are you?

 

...

 

Sadly not kidding...

I need highest color accuracy for my work so a TN with limited grey-scale is a no-go for me.

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But we still have hopes for 4k 120hz 17" display by the year end. Rumored to be ips, i guess) But after that TN news i'm no longer confident.

4K 120Hz IPS with 100% adobeRGB is like a dream

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

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TN isn't a deal breaker for me either.  I've found IPS to be overrated quite a bit too. I'll take 120hz any day of the week. Of course I'd prefer IPS. I'd be nice if 1440p was a thing too.

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If they'd make good IPS panels for mobile in terms of response time, it'd be fine. IPS desktop panels are 8-bit with often 100% (or close to) adobe RGB; minimum 72% NTSC, with 4ms response on 144Hz panels. Laptops have 25ms response times for 6-bit panels at 60Hz.

 

The 4K AUO is 8-bit which I know is why Prema wants it ;) but laptop panels on the whole should improve. If we're getting good TN 120Hz panels while they fix up the IPS panels, great. But I swear any 25ms 6-bit 120Hz IPS panel I see I'm personally punching through for thinking that that's acceptable to sell to people >__>

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If the screen really is a 6bit TN panel I will seriously buy an Alienware 17 R4 4K touch over the P870DM pascal....

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1 hour ago, str8_an94baller said:

If the screen really is a 6bit TN panel I will seriously buy an Alienware 17 R4 4K touch over the P870DM pascal....

So, you're quite the glutton for punishment, eh? Kind of like throwing the baby out with the bath water just to have a better screen? That's a pretty massive downgrade on everything else.

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2 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

So, you're quite the glutton for punishment, eh? Kind of like throwing the baby out with the bath water just to have a better screen? That's a pretty massive downgrade on everything else.

 

Unless there's an equivalent (or better) option for a 4K IPS screen on the Clevo, I don't think I would buy the pascal series laptop.

The AW17R4 is also a tough choice to pick because of the bad internal components.

 

At the end I'm still stuck at a rock and a hard place between the two.

 

 

 

Though if you ignore the components inside the current 17R3, the screen's color accuracy and gamut is pretty good (almost 98% adobe rgb, 99% srgb). AUO 2DK4K-B173ZAN is the model. Plus it's not that expensive of an upgrade compared to some P870DM resellers out there that charge an arm/leg for 4K option.

 

1080 -> 4K prices

 

 

 

Origin - 220 usd but the base price (2k, 1x 970M) + vga upgrade (+700 980) skyrockets the price - not prema partner

Eurocom - 490usd

EVOC - 600usd

RJtech - 300usd (not prema partner)

Mythlogic - 645usd

 

As for self install, well, I don't think I'm that brave yet...

 

 

AW17R3 - 250usd (dell web) / 4K Touch

Not mentioning that the AW has IGZO+touch (not something that I would use, but it's there) compared to the Clevo's AUO AHVA P870DM (ghosting?)

 

 

 

I do have a nice desktop monitor but that doesn't mean I would tolerate a crappy screen on the go :|

Edited by str8_an94baller

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To be quite frank, I do see your point with the 4K screen on the Clevos, but I'd rather install it myself over getting one of those AWs. Optimus is a no-no for me for when I want to sit down and game. Or stream (whenever I do that again).

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45 minutes ago, D2ultima said:

To be quite frank, I do see your point with the 4K screen on the Clevos, but I'd rather install it myself over getting one of those AWs. Optimus is a no-no for me for when I want to sit down and game. Or stream (whenever I do that again).

 

 

If someone can do the install for me then... :P

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Nobody should have to tolerate a crappy screen on the go. Nor should they have to tolerate all of the internals being a crappy BGA turdbook. The latter is inexcusable and unforgivable. There needs to be the best of all worlds available, because compromise always sucks.

 

I understand when there is a business need for 4K, such as what @Prema mentioned, but anyone that has never experienced 4K on a screen as tiny as a 17 inch laptop really needs to borrow one for a while to be 100% certain they can put up with it before spending any money. I have handled 3 or 4 different review systems (all Dell except for one Clevo) with 4K screens for far longer than enough to adjust and develop a tolerance for them under normal circumstances. I find the experience absolutely miserable and barring something short of a magic trick I will never pay money for a 4K screen that small. I have not seen an example (yet) of a 4K laptop LCD that can scale to 100% with comfortably readable text or run at 1080p without losing quality. Gaming at 4K is a chore no matter how powerful your system is, and having to run 200% scaling for text to be as eye-friendly as 1080p at 100% largely defeats any purpose I would have for one. If I cannot fit more stuff on the screen at one time, there is basically no point whatsoever to having it from my personal perspective. The only reason I would want it is for tons of extra usable screen real estate, and without that benefit it's worthless to me. 

 

I'm not saying this for those that have already experienced 4K at 17 inches already and found they like it... fair enough, not trying to be argumentative as much as helpful. Consider this a dire warning for those that have not experienced 4K at 17 inches and fallen in love with it that there is a very high probability you will absolutely despise it and wish you had gone with 1080p. I'm serious... borrow one and test drive it as long as you can before blowing any cash on something you may hate with a passion. 

 

Now, 1440p at 120Hz might be pretty nice. And, reading text at 100% scaling on 1440p is doable on 17 inch, but borderline too small. I don't remember seeing any laptops with 2560x1440 screens at any refresh rate, TN or IPS. Seems like the OEMs just skipped over that and went to 4K because the notion is popular on Facebook. 

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19 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

Nobody should have to tolerate a crappy screen on the go. Nor should they have to tolerate all of the internals being a crappy BGA turdbook. The latter is inexcusable and unforgivable. There needs to be the best of all worlds available, because compromise always sucks.

 

I understand when there is a business need for 4K, such as what @Prema mentioned, but anyone that has never experienced 4K on a screen as tiny as a 17 inch laptop really needs to borrow one for a while to be 100% certain they can put up with it before spending any money. I have handled 3 or 4 different review systems (all Dell except for one Clevo) with 4K screens for far longer than enough to adjust and develop a tolerance for them under normal circumstances. I find the experience absolutely miserable and barring something short of a magic trick I will never pay money for a 4K screen that small. I have not seen an example (yet) of a 4K laptop LCD that can scale to 100% with comfortably readable text or run at 1080p without losing quality. Gaming at 4K is a chore no matter how powerful your system is, and having to run 200% scaling for text to be as eye-friendly as 1080p at 100% largely defeats any purpose I would have for one. If I cannot fit more stuff on the screen at one time, there is basically no point whatsoever to having it from my personal perspective. The only reason I would want it is for tons of extra usable screen real estate, and without that benefit it's worthless to me. 

 

I'm not saying this for those that have already experienced 4K at 17 inches already and found they like it... fair enough, not trying to be argumentative as much as helpful. Consider this a dire warning for those that have not experienced 4K at 17 inches and fallen in love with it that there is a very high probability you will absolutely despise it and wish you had gone with 1080p. I'm serious... borrow one and test drive it as long as you can before blowing any cash on something you may hate with a passion. 

 

Now, 1440p at 120Hz might be pretty nice. And, reading text at 100% scaling on 1440p is doable on 17 inch, but borderline too small. I don't remember seeing any laptops with 2560x1440 screens at any refresh rate, TN or IPS. Seems like the OEMs just skipped over that and went to 4K because the notion is popular on Facebook. 

 

Well, if there's a Z170 MXM TB3 EGPU enabled laptop with 1080p AHVA/IPS/IGZO and 99% SRGB and Adobe RGB...

the world will burn :P

But a man can dream right?

 

 

There's also the Alienware 13 with OLED screen, what does everyone think of an OLED screen?

Edited by str8_an94baller

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You hit the nail on the head Mr.Fox, I originally lusted after 4K for use as a PC monitor but i dont think hardware and software have quite caught up just yet. I love my tv for movies (P55-C1) but for use as a monitor it sucks, almost no  input lag but the scaling is just terrible (IMO) then you have to have crazy GPU power to run games (i was running a 980ti) and dont forget games may support 4K but their menus do not. I think 1440p is the perfect resolution but for the 21" and below i think 1080p is more than fine (especially if its 120hz).

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I don't have any experience with OLED on anything personally, so I really cannot say. Durability might not be great based on rumors I have read. 

 

The rumblings suggest OLED is getting queued up to be made a popular cash-cow by the new tech mind-control group, but whether it is actually amazing or not remains to be seen. I won't bite unless I can test it for free for at least a little while to be sure I like it before spending my money.

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6 minutes ago, str8_an94baller said:

 

Well, if there's a laptop with 1080p AHVA/IPS/IGZO and 99% SRGB and Adobe RGB...

 

 

 

There's also the Alienware 13 with OLED screen, what does everyone think of an OLED screen?

From what i gather the panel itself is gorgeous but i have not seen any reviews or specs on the panel itself. I was thinking about picking one up as im going on a 2 month TDY and the P870 refresh is a ways off but the BGA CPU/GPU + only being a dual core turned me off...the wait continues. 

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I'd really like to see more 1440p and 1620p (1620p died out VERY fast, but did exist at 15.6"). 4k, which is 2160p is just too high of a resolution for a single GPU to drive in a modern game. Having only 2 resolution options, with one being 4x higher than the other is odd. Remember ~10 years back where you had around 3 resolution options for a system? Ex 1280x800, 1680x1050, and 1920x1200. It wasn't 1920x1200 vs 960x600, like 4k vs 1080p is today.

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3 minutes ago, cheneyx said:

You hit the nail on the head Mr.Fox, I originally lusted after 4K for use as a PC monitor but i dont think hardware and software have quite caught up just yet. I love my tv for movies (P55-C1) but for use as a monitor it sucks, almost no  input lag but the scaling is just terrible (IMO) then you have to have crazy GPU power to run games (i was running a 980ti) and dont forget games may support 4K but their menus do not. I think 1440p is the perfect resolution but for the 21" and below i think 1080p is more than fine (especially if its 120hz).

Thanks... I try to be accurate and based on my own experience I am scared for anyone that buys a 4K laptop 'on faith' they will like it. I was super excited every time I got a 4K machine to review, and very disappointed each and every time. I do like 4K technology, but until they start selling laptops with 21 inch screens, it's just too small to be good for me at that resolution.

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... I don't remember seeing any laptops with 2560x1440 screens at any refresh rate, TN or IPS. Seems like the OEMs just skipped over that and went to 4K because the notion is popular on Facebook. 

I am using 2560x1440 on my 13.3" since a couple of years and love it. So 4K @ 17.1" should have a similar PPI...running fever atm, so if someone else wants to do the math. [emoji14]

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One thing we can all be very thankful for is that Clevo has not gone to those damned buttonless 'clickpad' pieces of trash that Dell uses almost exclusively now. They're basically a Mac-ish knock off and I got to tell you I haven't ever hated any part of any laptop as much as those absolutely worthless pointing devices. To call them miserable would be an understatement. Even the areas where the buttons SHOULD BE are touch-capacitive tracking surfaces. They're even more miserable than a feces touch screen notebook if you can imagine that, and that's saying a lot for me because there are few things I hate worse on computers other than filthy touch screens that have been slimed-over by human body fluid excretions.

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roughly the same DPI 220ISH VS 250ISH.

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3 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

One thing we can all be very thankful for is that Clevo has not gone to those damned buttonless 'clickpad' pieces of trash that Dell uses almost exclusively now. 

They did. They discarded it. My P370SM3 unfortunately has one of those crappy buttonless clickpads. Look at this abomination. Thankfully they discarded them since the SM-A series =D. Stupidly enough, the P375SM and P377SM didn't have the P370SM & P370SM3's clickpads. T_T.

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I dont use my P370EM clickpad that offten, but when I do I like it. I specially like the looks and huge tracking field. Overall I don't see what the fuzz is about it when you have a decent mouse to use.

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