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[POLL] 2016 and Beyond: What do YOU want?

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THIS :D >>>17.3" 4K/8K 120Hz:

News&Event?News Release?Japan Display Inc.

EDIT:

Clevo R&D has product meetings for 2016-17, so if you have anything to add to this thread do it now!

Few points that came up:

- Should we expand use of MXM desktop GPUs?

- Should we use MXM 3.0b with Mobile BGA CPUs?

- Should we launch 13" super monster?

- Should we make 18.4 model?

- How critical is storage? Shall we implement more of M.2 drives and drop 2.5" altogether?

for me storage *IS* critical. I now have both 2.5" slots full - 1 with normal 2TB 7200 rpm storage drive and another 1TB SSD for games etc

considering the price of M.2 still, I would not like to see 2.5" removed completely

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like others mentioned, a laptop with ~14" huge battery but reasonable slim and light with maybe desktop cpu or at least quadcore cpus, TB3, no dgpu

in other words a laptop wich is portable and usable as a laptop and at home a high end gaming rig

because now i have tu use a dell xps13, which will have TB3 but too weak cpu as it only has a i7 6500u

a clevo laptop with 980m

but nothing for 4k gaming which sucks

so i will have to choose next when 14/16nm gpus arrive between my clevo or a new 4k gaming rig

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I actually think @chap a model like that may not sell all that well due to the cooling needed, but it's an interesting idea.

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look at the dell xps15 its pretty slim even has a 960m and quad core cpu, ofc it s no desktop model but nontheless.

my oced 3920xm with 4,3ghz produces 50w in gaming... i think a skylake i7 6700 will not produce much more tdp when gaming, so it should be possible in some way

or fore example your 4800mq with the additional multipliers would already be sufficient for a 980ti via tb3

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sounds definitely interesting. for that to be profitable for clevo though, tb3 gpu enclosures will have to become a thing, and that without having to mod the crap outta ur system [emoji14]

cooling-wise, clevo wont have any issues, a W230SD like machine without dgpu, but desktop cpu instead is entirely within the realm of possibility :)

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

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sounds definitely interesting. for that to be profitable for clevo though, tb3 gpu enclosures will have to become a thing, and that without having to mod the crap outta ur system [emoji14]

cooling-wise, clevo wont have any issues, a W230SD like machine without dgpu, but desktop cpu instead is entirely within the realm of possibility :)

Well in size, yes. But in weight, it may be a different story. The GS30 is a small machine and can be powerhousey when hooked up, but it's also quite light, for the function of being a "laptop" when undocked. A desktop i7 using the iGPU won't really bring a whole lot of battery life, will weigh a lot to be cooled properly, and the power brick would need to be substantially large (120W minimum, with 150W-180W for overclocking).

Going with the non-OCable chips alone it might be different; an i7-6700 with a TDP lock and a 120W PSU might be okay. But in my head I can't get it to marry the practicality of a GPU-less laptop and dock like the GS30 can.

Of course, the CPU will be far better by not being BGA crap, but still. It doesn't seem to fit the part with battery life or weight, though the size/power applications definitely are promising. For people who'd pick stuff like the GS30 though (and I've met a few online) even a W230SD would be too heavy doing its laptop-y parts.

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I am late to this thread, but my list must go on!

  • Good PCH cooling solution. I once decided to play Black Ops 2 while rendering a video in Sony Vegas 13 and watch a livestream. My PCH hit 105c even though my CPU never passed 85c.
  • Socketed CPUs forever, even if desktop CPUs must be used.
  • Socketed GPUs forever of course. Upgrade-ability is beautiful.
  • 120Hz 8-bit colour 1080p and 1440p panels (especially for the models in the class of the P7xxZM, P7xxDM and P870DM). I feel like any machine beyond my P370SM3 is somewhat of a downgrade if I can't have 120Hz again.
  • 3D vision to return. I'm also sad that to upgrade from 780Ms to 980Ms I'd have to lose 3D.
  • Larger single power bricks. I'm hoping we can at least get to 400W or 500W single brick systems on the quality that the current 330W bricks have.
  • Unlimited motherboard power allowance. Just like how our systems can use two 330W bricks currently, if we attach two single 400W or 500W bricks (building off the above point) we should be able to use it all. GPUs and CPUs are quite power hungry these days!
  • Better heatsinks. A lot of the heatsinks seem to come somewhat warped, or otherwise have poor contact, and even though the fans and cooling DESIGN is very good, the heatsinks all vary in effectiveness and lapping is often very beneficial. If they could all be perfect like how most of the old Alienwares (M17x, M18x) were, we'd be far better off.
  • Better cooling design. Machines like the P1xxSM-A and P37xSM-A are great, but they could be better as the P7xxZM models showed.
  • Better keyboards; with the quality of the D900 series at least (I've not used the P7xxZM keyboards; I cannot tell).
  • iGPU functionality (for Quicksync acceleration) on the desktop CPU machines (but not allowing the iGPU access to any displays). The desktop chipsets should allow this functionality.
  • Mux switches are always great; dGPU only mode for all machines should be possible.
  • Full overclockability support, and good BIOS options for end-users.
  • IF POSSIBLE, a bypass for the HQ mobile chips on the models using them to allow them to draw more power than their 47W/45W limits beyond 2.5 minutes. It's currently impossible for most machines, but I think you should be able to design the BIOS to override the limits of the CPU?
  • Good sized power bricks for all the machines. The P6xxSx and P6xxRx machines are nice at 180W but a 220W or 230W possibility would suit them very well.
  • Good QA for the machines' basic designs. I've seen some early P650Sx users complain that their HDMI ports refused to work due to the chassis' design, and modifying the case fixed the issue. Later machines shipped did not have this issue, but it shouldn't have happened with the first models.
  • Support for high memory speeds and some memory overvolting.
  • Brighter and nicer backlight control for keyboards (more than just 3 areas), and on models where not only the keyboard is backlit, ability to turn on/off backlights for each part that uses it (for example, lightbar + no keyboard lights + no red backlights on P375SM should be possible).
  • Nice colour gamuts for screens! 72% NTSC should be minimum; there's no reason to get less.
  • IPS panels with better response times, especially if they're the only option for a machine (like the P770ZM-G). Also 6-bit IPS panels are a joke.
  • Better audio! MSI's Dynaudio is fantastic and I think Clevos can get something at least nearly as good.
  • Better built in mics. My D900F mic was one of the best mics I've ever used; better than all mics on all headsets I've ever owned and even better than my current Blue Snowball by a mile. My P370SM3's mic however is not nearly as good, no matter how I set it up.
  • Let Prema do your BIOS
  • Taller rubber feet on the laptop. My D900F was fantastic; but my P370SM3 gains a great cooling boost simply by folding up 4 blocks of 2-ply toilet paper and putting one of those under each of the four feet of the laptop. It'd be great if at least all the performance laptops like the P7xxDM and P870DM would have taller feet to prevent the need for such a simple modification.
  • UEFI fast boot support WITHOUT Secure Boot, as well as legacy boot support
  • Always high vRAM count GPUs (at least as an option one can pay a little more for) even for P6xxRx type models.
  • Please pressure nVidia to enable SLI on/off without reboots in their drivers. We've done it with driver regedits, we've done it by using desktop drivers, it causes no problems with the machines, nVidia knows that it needs changing, but they're not doing it.
  • Support old BIOSes/systems for at least a couple generations for OS updates with hotkey software etc.
  • Thunderbolt 3 as well as mini DP/HDMI/USB 3(.1) ports
  • All external displays wired to the dGPU in laptops which have MUX switches and can use Optimus mode.

That list was longer than I thought. I feel like I'm asking for too much T_T.

Seriously let Prema do your BIOS

Hard to find much to add to this list. All good stuff.

One of the things I really, really want is an X99 laptop with 5960X, even if that means having a third 330W AC adapter to go with it.

I'd also like to see 60Hz displays go bye-bye on everything other than low-budget Best Buy and Walmart crapbooks. We are about to enter 2016, so 120Hz 1920x1080 should be the new entry-level norm for all business class and enthusiast/gamer notebooks. I don't know why we're stuck with the same low refresh rates for everything. LCD manufacturers need to start trying a whole lot harder to be awesome.

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I am late to this thread, but my list must go on! Copied slightly from @D2ultima Hope it's okay. Is not the best in English... But this is a minimum Wishlist for me. Overclocking is a BIG must on high end enthusiast/gamer notebooks.

Socketed CPUs forever, even if desktop CPUs must be used. really want is an X99 laptopwith preferably an 5960X. All processors of best binned quality. Even with K processors. A big must.

Socketed GPUs of course. Upgrade-ability is beautiful. Always high vRAM count GPUs

120Hz 1080/1440p panels.

Larger single power bricks. I'm hoping we can at least get 450W single brick = 2x450w for Sli.

Full overclockability support, and good BIOS options for end-users.

UEFI fast boot support WITHOUT Secure Boot

Support old BIOSes/systems for at least a couple generations for OS updates with hotkey software etc.

Support for high memory speeds and some memory overvolting.

Unlimited motherboard power = use of two 450W bricks or 3x330w.

Better heatsinks/Better cooling design.

Let Prema do your BIOS

iGPU functionality (for Quicksync acceleration) on the desktop CPU machines (but not allowing the iGPU access to any displays). The desktop chipsets should allow this functionality.

Bigger keyboard

Mux switches are always great; dGPU only mode for all machines should be possible.

Brighter and nicer backlight control for keyboards

Nice colour gamuts for screens! 72% NTSC should be minimum; there's no reason to get less.

Taller rubber feet on the laptop. If the laptop becomes 3 - 5 mm higher have nothing to say.. Better cooling.

Please pressure nVidia to enable SLI on/off without reboots in their drivers. We've done it with driver regedits, we've done it by using desktop drivers, it causes no problems with the machines, nVidia knows that it needs changing, but they're not doing it.

Thunderbolt 3 as well as mini DP/HDMI/USB 3(.1) ports

All external displays wired to the dGPU in laptops which have MUX switches and can use Optimus mode.

Thanks.

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Hard to find much to add to this list. All good stuff.

One of the things I really, really want is an X99 laptop with 5960X, even if that means having a third 330W AC adapter to go with it.

I'd also like to see 60Hz displays go bye-bye on everything other than low-budget Best Buy and Walmart crapbooks. We are about to enter 2016, so 120Hz 1920x1080 should be the new entry-level norm for all business class and enthusiast/gamer notebooks. I don't know why we're stuck with the same low refresh rates for everything. LCD manufacturers need to start trying a whole lot harder to be awesome.

I am late to this thread, but my list must go on! Copied slightly from @D2ultima Hope it's okay. Is not the best in English... But this is a minimum Wishlist for me. Overclocking is a BIG must on high end enthusiast/gamer notebooks.

Socketed CPUs forever, even if desktop CPUs must be used. really want is an X99 laptopwith preferably an 5960X. All processors of best binned quality. Even with K processors. A big must.

Socketed GPUs of course. Upgrade-ability is beautiful. Always high vRAM count GPUs

120Hz 1080/1440p panels.

Larger single power bricks. I'm hoping we can at least get 450W single brick = 2x450w for Sli.

Full overclockability support, and good BIOS options for end-users.

UEFI fast boot support WITHOUT Secure Boot

Support old BIOSes/systems for at least a couple generations for OS updates with hotkey software etc.

Support for high memory speeds and some memory overvolting.

Unlimited motherboard power = use of two 450W bricks or 3x330w.

Better heatsinks/Better cooling design.

Let Prema do your BIOS

iGPU functionality (for Quicksync acceleration) on the desktop CPU machines (but not allowing the iGPU access to any displays). The desktop chipsets should allow this functionality.

Bigger keyboard

Mux switches are always great; dGPU only mode for all machines should be possible.

Brighter and nicer backlight control for keyboards

Nice colour gamuts for screens! 72% NTSC should be minimum; there's no reason to get less.

Taller rubber feet on the laptop. If the laptop becomes 3 - 5 mm higher have nothing to say.. Better cooling.

Please pressure nVidia to enable SLI on/off without reboots in their drivers. We've done it with driver regedits, we've done it by using desktop drivers, it causes no problems with the machines, nVidia knows that it needs changing, but they're not doing it.

Thunderbolt 3 as well as mini DP/HDMI/USB 3(.1) ports

All external displays wired to the dGPU in laptops which have MUX switches and can use Optimus mode.

Thanks.

The only thing I hate is Intel pushing back Skylake-E. X99 chipset would have half a year to a year before the new chipset comes out, while that socket revision will last until cannonlake-e. Also, I second d2's suggestion on both lvds and eDP unless the market will phase out lvds altogether... I'll write more later when I'm not on my phone.

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THIS :D >>>17.3" 4K/8K 120Hz:

News&Event?News Release?Japan Display Inc.

EDIT:

Clevo R&D has product meetings for 2016-17, so if you have anything to add to this thread do it now!

Few points that came up:

- Should we expand use of MXM desktop GPUs?

- Should we use MXM 3.0b with Mobile BGA CPUs?

- Should we launch 13" super monster?

- Should we make 18.4 model?

- How critical is storage? Shall we implement more of M.2 drives and drop 2.5" altogether?

Don't drop 2.5" yet. While M.2 SATA SSDs are comparable in performance to 2.5" SSDs in light workloads, they aren't for heavier workloads. It's physical: more NAND chips = more parallelism/interleaving. The number of controller channels used will determine performance too between 2.5" and M.2. More channels = more parallelism/interleaving. Generally, 2.5" uses 8 channels while M.2 may use 4 or 8 depending on the model.

Don't get caught up in M.2 PCIe sequential numbers. In an OS environment, a higher performance SATA SSD will beat most PCIe SSDs. Look at the low queue depth random numbers for PCIe. They aren't there yet. In steady state - real world performance, a 2.5" SSD is still a top choice.

There aren't enough choices for NVMe drives yet. The price is prohibitive.

2.5" offers a capacity advantage too. Currently, 2TB size is available in HDD and SSD and M.2 is only at 512GB.

The ZM/DM has it right, two of each. It's understandable where size constraints dictate more M.2 usage. Where space isn't an issue, 2.5" drives are still the better choice in many usage scenarios.

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I wish a clevo:

with high res display no glare ( about 60% more than full hd = 3072*1728, a mid way between quad HD and 4K), possibily 90/120hz

a full 18.4" screen size on a 17.3" chassis

chassis thinner and lighter, with premium materials

desktop CPU i7 Skylake 65W (the temperatures are important)

desktop VGA GTX 970/980 (prices?)

New durable technology of dissipation to limit the temperatures (an hybrid cooling like Sapphire Vapor-X bult in)

larger fan and more quiet (low rpm)

2 ssd pci ex 4x

5.1 speaker with high wattage

better built in mic, no bkgrnd noise, eco reduction, better input quality

mechanical keyboard

thinner and lighter PSU

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I wish a clevo:

with high res display no glare ( about 60% more than full hd = 3072*1728, a mid way between quad HD and 4K), possibily 90/120hz

a full 18.4" screen size on a 17.3" chassis

chassis thinner and lighter, with premium materials

desktop CPU i7 Skylake 65W (the temperatures are important)

desktop VGA GTX 970/980 (prices?)

New durable technology of dissipation to limit the temperatures (an hybrid cooling like Sapphire Vapor-X bult in)

larger fan and more quiet (low rpm)

2 ssd pci ex 4x

5.1 speaker with high wattage

better built in mic, no bkgrnd noise, eco reduction, better input quality

mechanical keyboard

thinner and lighter PSU

You're going against the laws of physics with half your desires.

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What are other fundamental design flaws (like the PCH not being cooled properly) which they have to improve on?

The 17.3" with a 15" keyboard. A bigger keyboard would definitely fit the chassis.

I won't say the heatsinks are a design flaw, they do the job. But they need tighter tolerances from Foxconn. There should be no stories of warped heatsinks in forums. The aluminum duct tape - exhaust mods were addressed with a simple solution. It's time for better QA with heatsinks.

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This is the wishes' topic...

I've no problem with people wishing for stuff, but going against the laws of physics isn't likely to happen. Ever.

You're doing the same thing everyone who buys Razer Blades is doing when you're asking for the most powerful, heaviest, hottest equipment in a thinner and lighter chassis than what's already available, while also getting a lighter, smaller PSU. While also asking for a larger fan, a larger screen in a smaller chassis and for it to be quieter in said thinner/lighter chassis, with a mechanical keyboard.

Everything contradicts itself, unless you were expecting those things to be spread out across three or four different models.

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I've no problem with people wishing for stuff, but going against the laws of physics isn't likely to happen. Ever.

You're doing the same thing everyone who buys Razer Blades is doing when you're asking for the most powerful, heaviest, hottest equipment in a thinner and lighter chassis than what's already available, while also getting a lighter, smaller PSU. While also asking for a larger fan, a larger screen in a smaller chassis and for it to be quieter in said thinner/lighter chassis, with a mechanical keyboard.

Everything contradicts itself, unless you were expecting those things to be spread out across three or four different models.

You are a little dreary, man

just live and let live...

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LOL, you both win, let's leave it at that guys! :D

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TBH I'll settle for USB Type C and USB 3.1 for e-GPU (that or TB3 or whatever can handle the throughput for e-GPU) so I can get some extensibility at the home desk.

What do I want? At the very least TB3 or USB 3.1 (Whichever is faster and out in mid-2016) for desktop e-GPU solutions. Kind of frustrating how little mPCIE options there are for desktop station kits.

I'd also prefer a better gamut / quality display. The display on my P150SM-A is horrid.

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You could try replacing with this: AUO B156HW01 V4 Overview - Panelook.com

Yeah, but panel replacement is a bit work-intensive, and all for something with better picture quality (I assume) but no increase in resolution or refresh rate seems like a bit much. But thanks for sharing. I did some some mods about overclocking the display, but the whole thing makes me very nervous!

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Yeah, but panel replacement is a bit work-intensive, and all for something with better picture quality (I assume) but no increase in resolution or refresh rate seems like a bit much. But thanks for sharing. I did some some mods about overclocking the display, but the whole thing makes me very nervous!

Well you have a laptop with optimus, so you wouldn't be able to overclock your screen nor get a higher refresh rate in a default screen, because you're limited by the iGPU. Hence why us enthusiast-type people hate optimus, and AT WORST it should be switchable on/off in the BIOS using MUX switches... at BEST it should not exist.

The panel improvement is for the colours and overall look, and is easier on a P150SM-A than you might think, but up to you if you want to do it.

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Well you have a laptop with optimus, so you wouldn't be able to overclock your screen nor get a higher refresh rate in a default screen, because you're limited by the iGPU. Hence why us enthusiast-type people hate optimus, and AT WORST it should be switchable on/off in the BIOS using MUX switches... at BEST it should not exist.

The panel improvement is for the colours and overall look, and is easier on a P150SM-A than you might think, but up to you if you want to do it.

Thanks for the info. These days I use my monitor, so i think i'll wait on it, but I do appreciate you letting me know about this. I might revisit in the future if I still have this laptop in a year or two.

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Mostly vBIOS support - make clevo vBIOS available online (this makes having MxM more practical)

Better displays (ie higher color gamut)

and a docking station would be cool

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Dear Clevo,

The P870DM was a good step forward but in my opinion its lacking a few things i am looking forward too. Since its going to be a big investment for me. I & plenty of others would love something like this:

Skylake E + Pascal desktop GPU

4k Gsync capable screen (in 17/18 inch form factor)

And a bigger keyboard. (I know that Clevo is going to cheap out again.. But if they do not go for it, I might still consider buying it.)

And most important and final is a single PSU Solution to this. No wants to carry dual bricks!.. If it does not end up being that way.. then ill pass for sure!

Ill be okay with waiting a year for this to come true.. But I am sure if this becomes a reality, then it is going to be one of the most successful gaming laptop ever. Period.

Until then I have my faithful P170EM with 980M upgrade about to be overclocked.

P.S. A note to clevo: If you want to be the best laptop manufacturer out there, (Which you already somewhat are) You could perhaps give your ears to my request. And I guarantee you that I'll do your marketing for you for free! These specs will create a massive buzz in the market for gaming laptops.. You guys did a great job P870DM, especially completely removing the ODD Bay! Props to that. (ODD is a waste of internal laptop real estate. Especially in 2015 and on-wards)..

More to come in this discussion I really hope that Clevo is paying attention to it.

If there are more people out there who agree with me, then feel free to hit the thanks button or reply to it.

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