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Windows 8 and the Y500 -Your opinions please folks!

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When I purchased my IdeaPad Y580, it came with Windows 8 pre-installed. I unboxed it and booted it up. I was greeted by the part where you fill out your name, username, etc. Got done through that, got to the desktop (or Metro or whatever), tried launching an application, wasn't even sure how to do it. Once I did, I had no idea how to close it. After about 30 seconds, I was fed up, and even more so by not being able to find the damn Shut Down button, so I held the power button down to turn it off, plugged my Windows 7 USB Installer in, installed Windows 7 and that was that.

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Ok

I have heard soo much about Win8 being one big pile of s**** (from gaming buddies) and how windows 7 is sooo much better??

<useful lol=""></useful>

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I disagree with above posts. WIn 8 is a great OS.

Albeit design of win8 is a subjective thing, it's technical improvements are objective things. It boots faster, works faster, supports more hardware, default apps have also been improved: built-in pdf reader, some nice little things like weather and news apps, win+printScreen, native files & settings synchronisation with Microsoft's cloud... For me, these things are a lot more important than design. And you can always install "Start is back", or some other start replacement plus some "boot-to-desktop" utility, if you can't stand tiles.

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You are right. There are some features that could make Windows 8 the better choice. In questions of of performance Win8 and Win7 are on a par. MS would be clever to make a classic design possible by default. Then nobody would talk about it.

I decided to chose Win7 again because I'm not ready to try something new but the time will come. I am sure I would use the classic shell. I like my clear starmenu and my desktop. I can not take pleasure in tiles.

If you are free in your choice an ready for Win8 than take it. The Y500 is designed for it. The super duper Tochpad with multi touch gestures was integrated for that reason.Some kunktion keys will not work on Windows 7. (F9 and above)

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I bought Y500 without the software, installed Windows 8 from USB drive - I made it through microsoft software (windows 7 usb/dvd tool) I chose this system because I have ssd, I read that 8 supports such hard drives.

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I have a question regarding Y500 and Windows 8: Why are the tiles at the start screen so big? On my former Vaio the Windows 8 metro screen would have smaller tiles. On Y500 there are 5 tiles on a column, on my Vaio 6 tiles. How can this be fixed? I want smaller tiles. Update: Found the solution, whoever is curious on how to have 6 tiles on a column, PM me. I had 5 before, now I can get 6 :D

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Personally have been quite a fan with the speed improvements, but still prefer W7 for development because of the familiar interface and the large current knowledge base.

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Haven't read through the previous pages, but aside from the typical gripes with Win8 and its Metro UI, I also dislike the fact that Aero has been stripped from the OS, making it more difficult to distinguish between multiple open windows and which window your mouse cursor is locked to. Win7 put a shadow around the foreground window, making it easier to distinguish from background.

I also dislike that from an aesthetic perspective, everything is square/rectangular, making it even more difficult (at a glance) to distinguish between open windows. I also HATE the new font anti-aliasing/smoothing methods that we're forced to use in IE/metro/office apps. The font is noticeably blurrier. I understand the superior AA method used in Windows 7 didn't support rotatable screens (ie tablets) so a new, less accurate method is used in all Metro/Office/IE products. Would it have been that difficult to incorporate both methods into Win8 and have the OS distinguish whether you were running a PC or a tablet? I personally don't think so, and I think the decision was definitely driven by budget/greed. So ridiculously lame.

Also, in Windows 7, you could suppress ALL requests for Admin rights (UAC), and this wasn't an issue from a security standpoint so long as you used best practices and monitored what goes in/out from your computer. Windows 8, even with UAC "disabled" will still alert you to provide admin rights in a number of scenarios.

I also kinda miss being prompted/warned before being able to arbitrarily delete folders/files. There's probably a setting for this somewhere.

Two things I do like from Windows 8 are probably the new Ctrl+X menu that provides quick access to thing like device manager, control panel, etc. Also it does look like Win8 has a lighter memory/cpu footprint that Win7, but not SO much so that I see any reason to upgrade :/

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Win 8 makes me feel as if I'm having a big mobile phone, while I expect to have a desktop system. I could understand "Metro" interface if I had a touchscreen. However on Y500 there is no need to have those big tiles. Before uninstalling win8 I was trying to switch off Metro.

However, I had more serious troubles. I have USB SAT tuner which was working good under win 7, but was silently not working :(:(

Also installing Ubuntu on other partition caused problems with Windows 8 - actually I wasn't able to start Win 8 from grub...

I have nothing against Win 8 in general, except for it causes me a lot of troubles and is not useable in my particular case :)

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Win8 sucks, for me at least. UEFI is a pain and Win8 has tons of problems that even Vista didn't have. The Y400 is awesome, though: It has kinda bad build quality, but an octocore i7 and 650M for $600 refurb was an amazing deal. Now to install Ubuntu...

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octocore i7? and btw Windows 8 is so far ahead of Windows 7 in managing resources. It doesn't have problems, maybe you have because you don't know how to use it, and it seems for you that the whole world is at issue for this.

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I was not sure about win8, but decided to give it a try. It took me about three weeks with enoyance disabling features and trying to bring it back to win7, I used classicshell for this.

For my use business/work, 3D and light gaming win8 was pretty useless. I switched to a 120gb SSD with a fresh win7 install. Much better.

As of the learning curve theory I don't see the value in getting used to the metro GUI as it seems less efficient than the classic windows desktop. I prefer to have direct access to as much options and tools in the OS and software as possible.

In the end it comes down to how you use your computer...I will probably try the new version, hope they give users ability to change the hole menu layout.

The computer itself seems good in build quality and offer decent access to internal components say if you need to switch something or remove some dust. I did not like the touchpad much, and the wificard was absolutely useless. I am therefore currently stuck with the BIOS whitelist issue. Hope to resolve that soon to do some further testing.

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I was not sure about win8, but decided to give it a try. It took me about three weeks with enoyance disabling features and trying to bring it back to win7, I used classicshell for this.

For my use business/work, 3D and light gaming win8 was pretty useless. I switched to a 120gb SSD with a fresh win7 install. Much better.

As of the learning curve theory I don't see the value in getting used to the metro GUI as it seems less efficient than the classic windows desktop. I prefer to have direct access to as much options and tools in the OS and software as possible.

In the end it comes down to how you use your computer...I will probably try the new version, hope they give users ability to change the hole menu layout.

The computer itself seems good in build quality and offer decent access to internal components say if you need to switch something or remove some dust. I did not like the touchpad much, and the wificard was absolutely useless. I am therefore currently stuck with the BIOS whitelist issue. Hope to resolve that soon to do some further testing.

You haven't used Windows 8 enough to pinpoint the real issues. What you described is just your inability to adapt :) For 3D rendering and Photoshop, also video editing and other work that include high number of calculations, Windows 8 is better at handling resources and providing an output result much faster. You are used with Windows 7 (which btw it doesn't have the ability to automatically configure windows for your ssd, most probably now it does stupid things that ruins the solid state drive), therefore you reject windows 8 based on metro GUI, which in fact is called Windows Modern UI. After you'll get past the new UI, and really see the differences you will see it makes your life much easier. Anyway this happens for every product in the world, and after 2 years everybody adapts and calls it the best...sigh..

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You haven't used Windows 8 enough to pinpoint the real issues. What you described is just your inability to adapt :) For 3D rendering and Photoshop, also video editing and other work that include high number of calculations, Windows 8 is better at handling resources and providing an output result much faster. You are used with Windows 7 (which btw it doesn't have the ability to automatically configure windows for your ssd, most probably now it does stupid things that ruins the solid state drive), therefore you reject windows 8 based on metro GUI, which in fact is called Windows Modern UI. After you'll get past the new UI, and really see the differences you will see it makes your life much easier. Anyway this happens for every product in the world, and after 2 years everybody adapts and calls it the best...sigh..

I've used Windows 8 for the last 6 months and still hate it.

It's not about adapting at all, because it is fundamentally broken for a certain subset of users and no amount of adapting will change that. The only reason I'm sticking with it is that I don't want to spend the money to get another copy of Windows 7, and StartIsBack at least makes it bearable, otherwise I'd be back to 7 in a heartbeat.

You know how people talk about "no compromises?" We'll I'm convinced the entire thing is a compromise. A touch-optimized tablet/smartphone UI and UX has absolutely no place in a desktop/laptop environment for power users. It actually disrupts your workflow, decreases productivity, and generally makes it slower to get things done, which is just unacceptable in my book.

And all the anecdotal evidence of Windows 8 being "much faster" than Windows 7 is just that--anecdotal evidence--until someone comes out with some hard numbers to prove it, but so far that hasn't been the case.

That assertion about SSD support in Windows 7 is blatantly false as it has native TRIM support just like Windows 8. When you install an SSD it automatically detects it and disables defragmentation and enables TRIM for the drive.

Windows 8 is a failure and will be regarded as one many years from now if it is not already apparent.

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So far I have not met a single user of Windows 8, who didn't complain about it. My flatmate bought a new laptop recently with Windows 8 pre-installed and the only thing that is stopping him from buying Windows 7 is just that he doesn't want to spend any more money on his computer... but there were few situations that he considered doing that after all.

I also would like to confirm, that Windows 7 automatically detects SSDs and configures the system accordingly.

Florin, you should read some articles reviewing Win8 when it came out. It was swarming with bugs and included a new interface NO ONE ever requested while not resolving many issues present in all Windowses like big footprint. To make things worse as of now you have no option to return to classic interface without using 3rd party software.

You know Windows 8.1 has just went RTM? Even Windows Vista, which was also swarming with bugs and was hated by many, received a Service Pack after 2 years while Windows 8.1 was released almost exactly after 8. It makes you think, now doesn't it? Especially if you consider what changed in Win8.1

If you look at the timeline of Window releases you might notice a certain pattern, which is that every good Windows is followed by crappy Windows. Windows 8 is definitely the latter. Is 8.1 going to be a good one although it's not exactly entirely new OS? Time will show.

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The sad thing is 8.1 still doesn't change what haters hate most about 8, which is its godawful UI. It makes Metro more customizable and gives it more functionality, but what do I give a crap about Metro for? I don't even want to look at the darn thing, much less use it on a daily basis, no matter how much M$ spruces it up. Classic desktop still beats it in every way and I don't need a redundant side of my PC that I never use. Oh yeah, and the much-heralded "return" of the Start Button? It's a freakin' joke. It's just a physical button which dumps you into Metro, again, which is no different from what the little floating icon did previously in 8. Bring back the Start Menu and then we'll talk, Microsoft. Other than that, 8.1 adds a bunch of native Metro apps that I don't give a rat's ass about either. As for adding boot to desktop? Well those of us who've stuck to 8 this long have already installed third-party addons like StartIsBack long ago to ease our suffering, so this is something we've had for a while. Did you really think we needed you to give us what we want, MIcrosoft?

I'm so glad I dual-booted 8.1 Preview on a VHD when it first released, because that allowed me to get rid of it *just like that* when I found out nothing had really changed, no mess and no reformat needed.

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@sergioosh @octiceps I read the articles, I know what I am talking about. I'm a Microsoft software engineer on virtualization, repackaging and migration data. Regarding the structure of Windows 8 in comparison to Windows 7 I think I know better. From what I see you are affected by the UI, which is more related to taste than functionality (and again this is the normal behavior of the mediocre user, at first he does not accept the change then after 2 years he embrace it and calls it the best). On the resource managing part (RAM, SSD usage) or services, Windows 8 is far ahead. When I said SSD configuration, I wasn't referring to TRIM, that's by default, it was implemented long time before, I was more pointing out other things like power consumption or read write values (are higher on Windows 8). Anyway I won't write anymore on this subject since is hard to convince normal users on how the Windows 8 structure is different from Windows 7 and what it does best, when all they see is the UI. No further comments.

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Florin, let me tell you one thing. Computer is a tool. Tool to work and to entertain. If I have to learn or "get used to it" in order to use or to enjoy it, then it stops being a tool and becomes a nuisance. It's even worse when you force solutions that are mostly rejected by community without even giving a choice to use what we are used to. True, often it is related to taste. So... what does that change? For most users that's what they see and that's exactly what they don't like. It's the same with Windows Server 2012. It is regarded as a big upgrade compared to previous one with only one thing pointed out... UI. If you say it will take me 2 years to get used to Win8 UI then you just saved me a lot of trouble. I simply won't touch it at all.

When I said SSD configuration, I wasn't referring to TRIM, that's by default, it was implemented long time before, I was more pointing out other things like power consumption or read write values (are higher on Windows 8).

Implemented long time before? Another reason to doubt what you are writing. TRIM was introduced for the first time in Windows system in (guess what) Windows 7... Also, you're taking back what you said, because you clearly stated quote: "it doesn't have the ability to automatically configure windows for your ssd, most probably now it does stupid things that ruins the solid state drive" which is not true.

In general I do not doubt they improved many things in Win8, but what they blew is the UI, and that overshadows most of those improvements. Especially for those "normal users" who won't be able to tell the difference other than the UI.

On one hand I find it hard to believe you actually are who you are claiming to be, but on the other hand you do sound like someone affiliated with M$.

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Yes, it was implemented long time before, and on that statement I was referring to Windows 7. Don't know what is not clearly in what I wrote. I bought an ssd of 64 GB when the costs were higher, like 300$. I know through what Windows 7 went to optimize SSD and it still needs now additional configurations. You want more details, okay.. in Windows 7, Superfetch tracks and copies your most frequently used applications to system memory to reduce load times. Superfetch is based on the similar Prefetch feature available in Windows XP. Superfetch/Prefetch is not needed on an SSD under Windows 7, and should be disabled for optimal performance. In Windows 8, Superfetch functions differently than in previous versions of Windows, and should not be disabled. How about that? And this is not the only thing. I'm not MS affiliated, I just know what to use and how to use it, and if I don't know I try to learn it not bash it.

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Florin it's obvious you have a lot of bias and frankly I don't find you very trustworthy based on your comments. First you claim to be a "Microsoft software engineer on virtualization, repackaging and migration data" and then you backtrack in a later post with "I'm not MS affiliated." Your assertion that the UI is "more related to taste than functionality" is just flat-out wrong. GUI affects everything in a modern operating system. This isn't DOS anymore, we're not interacting with the OS through a command-line interface. The UI is the most basic and intuitive means we have of using our PC's and probably affects the overall UX more than any other factor. The simple fact of the matter is Windows 8 is clumsy and awkward when controlled with a keyboard and mouse and no amount of patching it up will change that until they cut out the redundant half of the OS entirely for us traditional PC users and reinstate the functionality that was removed from the classic desktop environment.

Calling the average user "mediocre" is not doing you any favors either, because in the end the customer is always right. We vote with our wallets and market forces always win out in the end because this is a very competitive arena. Microsoft can't dictate what we want. It was Steve Jobs who said "people don't know what they want until you show it to them." But unlike Steve, Microsoft has never found success using that strategy. In reality Microsoft needs us more than we need Microsoft, and they are becoming less and less relevant in this day and age. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if they are completely gone from the market in a few decades.

Look at it this way: If Microsoft's flagship tablet line, their first foray into the PC hardware space and a device that was designed to unveil and showcase Windows 8, utterly failed, causing them to take a $900 million charge on unsold inventory and be hit with a class-action lawsuit from angry investors, how does it bode well for the future of this troubled OS? This particular situation is but a microcosm of Windows 8 as a whole and the path of failure it is heading down.

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@octiceps it seems you are too young for IT industry, when you say Microsoft Software Engineer, it doesn't mean you work for the corporation, it means you have a degree of knowledge on their products. Same goes for VMware or Cisco. I think you are just too inexperienced to understand how Windows works, for you it's only the GUI. Anyway I understand what is your level of understanding so I will refrain to post on this thread.

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@octiceps it seems you are too young for IT industry, when you say Microsoft Software Engineer, it doesn't mean you work for the corporation, it means you have a degree of knowledge on their products. Same goes for VMware or Cisco. I think you are just too inexperienced to understand how Windows works, for you it's only the GUI. Anyway I understand what is your level of understanding so I will refrain to post on this thread.

And you sir resort to argumentum ad hominem because you have nothing intelligible with which to refute my points or address the substance of my argument. It's clear your command of the English language is not a strong point either as there is a disparity between what you mean and what comes out in writing, at least it seems that way to a native English speaker such as myself.

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@octiceps well you might have stepped on a mine there. Command line is used extensively in Windows server and all unix-like systems. Unless you were referring to normal users only, then I agree.

Also... be careful, because you're slowly lowering to Florin's level of discussion...

@Florin you are aware than for the last few posts the only thing you do is calling others "inexperienced", saying we know nothing compared to you and trying to undermine everybody else's image instead of providing ANY arguments? Even your attempt to provide argument about TRIM and pre-fetch has hit a wall of your lack of knowledge by writing "in win8 it works differently".

Also, you are wrong when you say "Microsoft Software Engineer" means you have a certain knowledge but are not affiliated with M$. There are many certificates from M$, and the only ones related to Software Development are MTA and MCSD. Please do not use this term, as now you're just making every actual M$ software engineer look silly.

Are you familiar with the term "trolling"? I get the feeling that is your sole purpose of posting here. It's not even about being biased about Win8... Anyway, this topic is heading in a wrong direction as it slowly drifts away from the topic of Win8... Any mods here?

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I'm done talking back to Florin. I'd like to bow out of the discussion with this:

bill-gates-told-me-to-upgrade-to-windows-8-i-said-sorry-i-still-luv-vista-baby.jpg

Made me chuckle when I got it. :congratulatory:

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My own personal opinion of Windows 8 is that it the user interface is clunky. I prefer Windows 7. I immediately installed classic shell. There are a few new features that I like, but overall I would give it a C-.

Features I like:

File History

Explorer Ribbon

File Copy Graph

seems stable

Features I dislike:

Metro interface

Issues with libraries and Photo app when using a network drive

To install apps you have to sign in with a Microsoft account

System backup not easy to find

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