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Lucidlogix Virtu : internal LCD mode for AMD eGPUs

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Lucidlogix Virtu : internal LCD mode for AMD eGPUs

Why the interest in LucidLogix Virtu MVP?

If you have an NVidia Fermi/Keplar eGPU then you get the ability to render the image by the eGPU but display it on the internal LCD mode as part of the NVidia Optimus driver. AMD provide no comparable driver feature. The third-party software, LucidLogix Virtu, provides the same internal LCD mode as NVidia Optimus so is of interest to AMD eGPU users.

Are there any hardware pre-requisites for this to work?

Same as NVidia Optimus. You need a notebook with a Sandy/Ivy bridge and an active primary iGPU along with your eGPU. Now I'm not sure how old that eGPU can be other than the GTX660/HD7870 work fine with it. Do note that Optimus works with older Series-5 and Series-4 systems with an active iGPU too whereas Virtu has no support for those systems.

Which versions of products work?

<ul><li>Virtu MVP 2.0 is available for purchase from LucidLogix' online store at the cost of:

US$35: base product

US$45: included Hypersync

US$56: includes Hypersync and Hyperperformance

<A HREF="http://www.lucidlogix.com/eshop.shtml">lucidlogix.png</A>

Note: Hyperperformance and Hypersync options are supposed to improve in-game FPS, though one reviewer convincingly shows it's cheating here which I agree with.

Problem is the Virtu MVP 2.0 30-day trial product fails to install on a notebook with error noting it's not a desktop platform as shown below:

virtumvpinstallfail.th.jpg

<li>older Virtu 1.2.114 30-day trial. Confirmed does install and work on Series-6 (4530s - timohour) and Series-7 (13" MBP - Tech Inferno Fan).</ul>

The

youtube video gives a table showing the differences between the desktop and mobile editions, captured below:

virtumvp2mobile.png

How does Virtu compare to Optimus for performance?

See my Macbook review testing at http://forum.techinferno.com/implementation-guides/3062-%5Bguide%5D-2012-13-macbook-pro-gtx660ti-hd7870%408gbps-tb1-th05-win7.html#post42483 . Optimus is 16.5% faster at raw FPS. Virtu's Hyperperformance can see it provide better FPS than Optimus but it's a tweak that been found to be cheating.

This thread dedicated to discussion of all things LucidLogix Virtu . . .

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Workaround to install LucidLogix Virtu MVP on a notebook

So how can we get LucidLogix Virtu MVP/MVP2 working on our systems to get the Hypersync and Hyperperformance features?

1. It's possible to extract the Virtu MVP2 source using Innoextractor then use Inno Setup 5.5.x (unicode) after some minor .iss file modifications and get it to install. However, it doesn't work. I'm no expert on this process maybe this info may get others to have a more detailed look at what the installer is doing??

2. Use a desktop system as a surrogate to install Virtu MVP, noting the registry and file changes performed as a workaround to the installer halting the installation. This got Virtu MVP to work as detailed in the spoiler. This would ideally be done using regshot to get an accurate snapshot of the registry and file changes the installer does.

<ol><li> Install the standard LucidLogix Virtu 64-bit 1.2.114 from

LucidLogix with GPU Solution. If I skip this step then Virtu MVP doesn't activate. Strange.

<li>Extract LucidLogix VIRTU 2.1.220 64-bit.rar I created to a folder. This is LucidLogix Virtu 2.1.220 64-bit, a version newer than that available on LucidLogix's website that supposedly also works with Windows 8. It came from ASRock's download page.

<li>Mark the "Program Files" and "Users" directories then copy them to you c:\ folder. Specify to merge the contents of those folders with the existing ones of the same name. The \Users\LucidLogix folder should be moved to \Users\{your username\LogicLogix.

<li>Run reg1 to reg6 individually to add those items to your registry.

<li>Reboot your system and enjoy Virtu MVP running on a the latest Series-7 notebook systems.

</ol>

We get the LucidLogix Virtu MVP Mobile edition out of this

mvp1j.th.jpg mvp2.th.jpg mvp3d.th.jpg mvp4.th.jpg

You see that the product now identifies itself as LucidLogix Virtu MVP Mobile, a product that Google only mentions is being distributed by notebook manufacturer Origin with their latest EON notebooks. REF: Origin PC's Eon Laptops Get Virtu MVP Mobile.

Annoying LucidLogix in-game icon when running the 30-day trial version

virtuannoyance.th.jpg

It's almost there but not quite enough to ditch NVidia+Optimus and go for AMD+LucidLogix instead.

<strike>What we get is the trial version with it's in-game icon advertising as shown above letting you know it's LucidLogix Virtu MVP at work. It moves around the screen every few seconds. Hardly the sort of thing you want when playing your favorite game using the internal LCD.

I've tried the tips at Lucid Logix Virtu MVP license on Z86 Boards is it possible? [Archive] - My Digital Life Forums but have been unable to get it out of trial version into full version.

What we do need is LucidLogix to sell this as a standalone product at a reasonable price for AMD eGPU users. Their $40 Virtu MVP 2.0 product unfortunately doesn't install for us. </strike>

EDIT: Registry fix to get rid of the annoying in-game icon and status no longer shows trial version!!

trialmain.th.jpg trialabout.th.jpg hackedmainselect.th.jpg hackedabout.th.jpg

Above: main and status screens before then after applying the registry fix below

More details: this solution working was purely accidental. Reason is it uses a file that was installed from Virtu 64-bit 1.2.114 (c:\windows\SYSWOW64\appinit_dll.dll) that I didn't update with it's newer MVP 2.1.220 version. Do note that installing one newer Virtu MVP 2.1.221 will not allow this registry fix to work. So stick with Virtu 2.1.220 if want a freebie solution.

I found a registry hack that allows you to set the in-game icons to be set with the "on for a few seconds" option doing the trick. The registry hack also turns off the trial version in the status section. While the Hide option is also available in the in-game icon section it doesn't work. No complaints here, MafiaII is far more playable now I don't have to deal with that LucidLogix logo floating all over the screen. I've confirmed this also works for FFXIV bench, RE5 bench, DMCV4, DirtII, NFS Shift demo :)

Exceptions so far being 3dmark06 and 3dmark11. The later sees Virtu complain about being unlicensed as shown. The former just refuses to run and errors out. Renaming the registry entry back from "mode2" to "mode" sees Virtu startup in trial mode allowing these apps to run. Good enough workaround for benchmarking.

How to do this registry fix?<ol>

<li> Install LucidLogix Virtu MVP as per the installation guide above. Reboot system.

<li> HIT CTRL-ALT-DEL to bring up task manager. Kill off processes MVPControlPanel.exe and LucidServices.exe

<li> Run regedit and rename the following registry key to be something else. I call it 'mode2'. This makes it easy to reverse for those instances like running 3dmark06/3dmark11 benchmarking which otherwise fail to run as I described above.

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\LucidLogix\mode]

"mode"="253183BB6E00DD1138A1"

<li> Run c:\program files\LucidLogix\Virtu MVP\MVPControlPanel to restart LucidLogix Virtu MVP in the system tray.

<li> Run your game that uses the eGPU for rendering but will display on the internal LCD. LucidLogix' in-game icon appears for a few seconds only. Enjoy!!</ol>

Installing Virtu MVP 2.0 sources over Virtu MVP got rid of the 3dmark6/3dmark11 bug but get 30-day trial

I extracted Virtu MVP 2.0 using Inno Extractor, then copied over my hacked Virtu MVP install from the above spoiler:

- the {apps} directory over to c:\program files\LucidLogix\Virtu MVP

- {syswow64}\app_init.dll to c:\windows\sysWOW64\app_init.dll

- {%USERPROFILE_c_}\LucidLogix files to c:\program files\LucidLogix\Virtu MVP (except license.enc).

MVPcontrolpanel20 now tells me it's the 30-day trial. It works too :)

mvp2mbp.jpg

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wait are they saying we can use this to SLI a software nvidia gpu against virtual hardware?

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Have they taken the mobile solution away in favor of an exclusive deal with origin? Can't see MVP 2.0 for mobile any more.

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Have they taken the mobile solution away in favor of an exclusive deal with origin? Can't see MVP 2.0 for mobile any more.

The LucidLogix website never had MVP 2.0 for mobile for download. The MVP 2.0 trial version's installer will detect a mobile platform and fail to install. It was only after doing an install on a desktop and transposing it to a mobile platform (files+registry) that it would work.

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The LucidLogix website never had MVP 2.0 for mobile for download. The MVP 2.0 trial version's installer will detect a mobile platform and fail to install. It was only after doing an install on a desktop and transposing it to a mobile platform (files+registry) that it would work.

Thats what I thought. But I was hoping to find some kind of workaround apart from the one that had already been mentioned.

Seems they only offer it to certain laptop manufactures, which is a shame.

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"You need a notebook with a Sandy/Ivy bridge and an active primary iGPU along with your eGPU."

Could the series 5 work? even though it isn't Sandy or Ivy.

LucidLogix require a Sandy Bridge or newer iGPU. This will not work with the Arrandale CPUs. If you want internal LCD mode with those systems then get a NVidia card whose Optimus driver works with that Intel HD iGPU. To answer a previous point, details on how to acquire DIY eGPU Setup 1.30 are here.

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sir Tech Inferno Fan, is this still a working software? I tried it on my i5 3230M with Intel HD 4000 but it is not working?

Is it only the trial which is having an issue? I could not install it and it throws an error that I can only install in a desktop pc.

It should be purchased to have the proper version? Sorry for so much questions.

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[RIGHT]Internal Screen for ATI GPUs
with Virtu MVP 2.0[/RIGHT]




ATI eGPU + Internal Screen is today possible even for non windowed apps. Although Nvidia (with Optimus driver) when paired with an Intel onboard GPU can drive the internal screen at reasonable frame rates @ x1 2.0, ATI hasn't provided such driver solution yet. And, here comes the Virtu Driver. It is a 3rd party solution designed originally for Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge desktop systems which renders the image with the eGPU and displays on the iGPU.

Virtu Driver 3.0.109 silent upgrade, can also be installed on laptops!!!

Spoiler



Pre-requisities for Virtu functionality




  • laptop with Intel 6, 7 and 8 series chipset with iGPU enabled.
  • modern ATI GPU




Internal screen for ATI Radeon HDs only?
I am discussing about ATI GPUs cause Nvidia Fermi already have a solid Internal Screen solution and older Nvidia GPUs are not officially supported by the Virtu Driver. So we are actually talking for HD Radeon 4xxx, 5xxx, 6xxx, 7xxx and Rx-2xx.

The official driver was not originally designed for notebooks and up to the previous version (3.0.107)it was almost impossible to install on a laptop, unless you had a desktop computer (check out nando's guide above). The installer would hang with this message.

BUT with the latest update Virtu MVP 2.0 (3.0.109.29300) it will install even on an laptop PC a 30-day evaluation copy with HyperFormance and Virtual Vsync. It seems though that they don't sell it to customers anymore (I couldn't find any place to order it)

How to install
The setup is very easy.

  • THIS STEP IS VERY IMPORTANT. UPDATE YOUR INTEL iGPU DRIVER TO THE LATEST DRIVER PROVIDED BY INTEL. It seems to solve most problems (if not all of them). On some machines you need to open Device Manager, manually uninstall the device reboot and then you will be able to install Intel driver.



  • After you have finished driver setup of your eGPU reboot.

  • Install Virtu Driver (after you attach your eGPU) and reboot.


And here we go...

Experience so far


Although the first driver that Lucidlogix provided had many-many problems it seems like most of the problems have stopped and internal screen mode works without problems. I won't discuss here about HyperFormance since there are indications by other desktop and eGPU users that it does provide artificial results.

On the latest driver they also gave the user the opportunity to change the settings for the floating icon, even disable it. I set this always on for benchmarks so I can be sure that it was running and my eGPU was rendering the screen.

The only problem that I encountered was that I 3Dmark11 and 3Dmark13 would hang most of the time for no apparent reason. This hang also happens with older Virtu driver 1.2.114 so it could be something that has to do with my laptop. I could only ran a full 3Dmark11 test without problems and a custom 3Dmark13 test. Everything else that I tested works fine.

Benchmarking implementation @ x1 2.0 & @ x4 2.0
Following tables show the results on both Internal & External screen.
user/laptop
Screen
RAM
GPU
Direct X 9
Direct X 11
Ports
3D06
RE5
3D11
3D13
OVERALL
SM 2.0
HDR
OVERALL
Graphics
OVERALL
Graphics
timohour

HP Probook 6470b
@ 4Gbps
i7 3630QM
Intel HD4000
4GB 1600MHz
External
4GB
R9-280x
x1 2.0
24144
8979
12305
183
P8669
9654
6342
7286
EC HM76
Internal
R9-280x
x1 2.0
17006
7285
6549
68
P6821
7068
~5389
5529
EC HM76
Performance Difference
~29%
~19%
~46%
~63%
~21%
~27%
~15%
~24%
average~30%
goalque

Macbook Pro
@ 16Gbps
i7 4702HQ
Intel Iris Pro
16GB 1600MHz
External
4GB
R9-280x
x4 2.0
26108
10058
13609
199
P8947
9164
[url=http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/5675981"]6129
[/url][/CENTER]
[url=http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/5675981"]6841
[/url][/CENTER]
TB2
Internal
R9-280x
x4 2.0
24370
9679
11415
144
P8092
8255
[url=http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/5676173"]5254
[/url][/CENTER]
[url=http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/5676173"]5635
[/url][/CENTER]
TB2
Performance Difference
~7%
~4%
~16%
~27%
~10%
~10%
~14%
~18%
average~13%



Many thanks to goalque for his test results.

Verdict


As I have said in previous review of the product internal screen performance is limited by bandwidth. Previous results that I had with x1 1.0 gave unplayable results, while @ x1 2.0 it varies with an average of 30% lower than the external screen.

On the other hand using TB @ x4 2.0 (thanks to goalque) shows that the performance difference is minor (~13%), and any user with an AMD Radeon card can enjoy internal screen gaming at very reasonable framerates.
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@timohour: Thanks! I was aware of accelerated windowed apps, but after installing this on Win8.1, I got amazing retina full screen boost with a R9 280X + NA211TB + 2014 15” MBP Retina (Iris Pro). I quickly tested two games in internal screen: Tomb Raider and BF4. Both were sharp and very fluent to play. BF4 oddly showed some green ground areas. 3DMark11 performance mode began with numbers over 60 FPS - that I would only expected to see on external monitor! I couldn’t get the result because the program itself crashed. However, eGPU was stable all the time and no sign that AMD driver would crash.

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post-28870-14494999238515_thumb.jpg

Now this is getting really interesting, I booted without monitor plugged in and got these results:

(internal retina screen)

AMD Radeon R9 280X video card benchmark result - Intel Core i7 4702HQ,Apple Inc. Mac-3CBD00234E554E41 11890 (graphics, 96.4% of external monitor performance)

AMD Radeon R9 280X video card benchmark result - Intel Core i7 4702HQ,Apple Inc. Mac-3CBD00234E554E41 11848 (graphics, 96.1% of external monitor performance)

Then via DVI:

AMD Radeon R9 280X video card benchmark result - Intel Core i7 4702HQ,Apple Inc. Mac-3CBD00234E554E41 12325 -> IS THIS NEARLY 100% OF DESKTOP PERFORMANCE???

25.7% improvement to my previous test without Virtu MVP 2.0:

AMD Radeon R9 280X video card benchmark result - Intel Core i7 4702HQ,Apple Inc. Mac-3CBD00234E554E41

How is this possible? This was not my Crossfire setup, only one R9 280X. The card was very quiet during the tests. What would it be with a R9 290X or R9 295X2, I cannot imagine… For some reason 3DMark11 randomly crashes after this driver installation. It doesn’t seem to matter whether I am using internal or external screen. But I can restart the program.

Any gaming or performance test wishes?

EDIT: H-HyperFormance unchecked: (internal retina, 90.2% of real external monitor performance)

AMD Radeon R9 280X video card benchmark result - Intel Core i7 4702HQ,Apple Inc. Mac-3CBD00234E554E41

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How is this possible? This was not my Crossfire setup, only one R9 280X. The card was very quiet during the tests. What would it be with a R9 290X or R9 295X2, I cannot imagine… For some reason 3DMark11 randomly crashes after this driver installation. It doesn’t seem to matter whether I am using internal or external screen. But I can restart the program.

Hyperperformance is supposed to predict which frames (or rendering tasks) will never be shown and take them out so the GPU can work on what is needed.

You can read the anandtech verdict here:

" HyperFormance increases responsiveness and makes FPS meaningless. In order to work, HyperFormance will only make a difference if your normal frame rate is greater than your refresh rate, usually 60 FPS."

As it is shown in this review too by tweakdown.com you won't see any performance gain unless your framerate is already over your screen's refresh rate (usually 60Hz).

If it is lower it will make it worse.

LucidLogix has admitted that they used a special version for 3DMark benchmarks (I can't find the source right now), and that's why 3DMark decided to mark every test that uses Virtu (3DMark to get Lucid HyperFormance support - The Tech Report). You can see it in your tests...

All in all, you may see performance gain or losses and sometimes experience stuttering, but it is up to you to use HyperPerformance or not. Keep in mind that the results are artificial. :02.47-tranquillity:

Any gaming or performance test wishes?

Internal/External screens results for 3dmark06 and 13 would be helpful for other users. I could fill in the blanks to the original post for other users reference.

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As you can see 1920x1200 are much better than 2880x1800 (except from 3dMark06). I suspect that if you set a lower internal screen resolution (let's say 1440x900 - most benchmarks use lower resolution) you will have much better internal screen scores.

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As you can see 1920x1200 are much better than 2880x1800 (except from 3dMark06). I suspect that if you set a lower internal screen resolution (let's say 1440x900 - most benchmarks use lower resolution) you will have much better internal screen scores.

Here the Resident Evil 5 benchmark results (1280x800 windowed mode)

post-28870-14494999244687_thumb.png

When we compare 3D11 graphics score (Hyperformance disabled) to @Dschijn Optimus benchmarks here, and assume that he used the native 2880x1800 resolution, Optimus technology is approximately 5% (90% vs 95%) faster. The resolution does affect. For instance, the 3D13 internal screen benchmark scores vary between (75% - 89%) depending on the resolution (2880x1800 / 1440x900). 3D13 Fire Strike test showed only 1% difference between Optimus and Virtu MVP 2.0 (75% vs 76%).

As a final note, my setup seems to be one the rare with the AMD through TB2 on Win8.1. For now, prerequisite for stable AMD TB2 eGPU setup on Win8.1 is an enclosure providing 75W slot power. Meaning that it won’t be the most affordable choice. OS X with native AMD drivers may provide more stable eGPU environment. NVidia offers much large selection of GPUs which are less dependent on slot power. I have been working with a 6pin PCIe power plug solution for AKiTiO instead of using a powered 4pin molex riser but still, the results are not very promising for AMD. I would like to see the day when we have a $200 TB2 enclosure that supports 100% any GPU, AMD or Nvidia. Would be an ideal solution to use a cheap PCIe backplane, but as far as I know, the backplanes are specially configured to manufacturer’s Thunderbolt adapter card, so you can’t mix them.

EDIT: AMD + AKiTiO stability issues and possible solutions can be discussed on this thread: http://forum.techinferno.com/enclosures-adapters/7205-us%24189-akitio-thunder2-pcie-box-16gbps-tb2.html

post-28870-14494999245048_thumb.png

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Hi everyone,

 

there is a lot of success stories about getting NVIDIA Cards to work on internal LCD under Windows, using Optimus drivers.

 

But how about Radeon cards? I didn't find much details about AMD's switchable graphics support on MPBs with Iris iGPU.

 

Did anyone get R9 cards to work on MBP's internal LCD?

 

Thanx to admins for moving my original post to the proper topic :)

 

Edited by dax

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Has anyone tried those new "XConnect" drivers from AMD?

Are they a solution equivalent to Optimus or am I confusing things up?

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Apparently Virtu is no longer available from Lucidlogix website. Do we have any other alternative in using internal LCD monitor with AMD's egpu? Since i have just struck a pretty good deal R9 380x (which is a huge improvement from my current GTX 560ti) and want to use internal LCD monitor. FYI im using a PE4C 3.0 (EC).

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Hello guys was planning to buy an egpu adapter with mpcie connector,problem is i had heard that it is pretty tricky to get it right with amd gpu to work with laptop display? Where nvidia cards is easier because of the feature  optimus,and so i want to ask if anyone can run any amd cards on the egpu adapter successfully? Is the virtu mvp software will make the amd cards work with internal display? 

 

My laptop spec

asus x550ld

i5 4200u

4gb ram will upgrade to 8 later

gt820m

 

im planning to use sapphire hd7970 along with the egpu setup and a corsair vs650 psu

 

so anyone can confirm to me or share some experience with running amd cards with mpcie adapter on laptop display,cause I don't want to spent more to buy an external monitor 

Edited by Kyle Hong

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Hi guys, just joined!

 

I've been heavily researching the eGPU setup I'm going to be using, my laptop is a Lenovo G505s (Windows 8.1) and I will be using an AMD R9 390 Strix, which will in the long term go into a desktop PC, so I will get full use.

 

It's seems easy enough to set this up with an external display, but when it comes to an internal display things start getting complicated and, if you ask me, risky.

 

I'm fixed on an AMD card, don't want Nvidia. Lots have people seem to have had success with Nvidia Optimus, so I wanted to know if there's anyone who has used AMD Dynamic Switchable Graphics.

 

Not a big deal if I can't as an external display is fine, but it would still be nice.

 

Thanks in advance, Charlie.

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On win10 you will get bsod after installing lucid virtu. That project is abandoned.

The good thing is you can still use your internal display for multi-monitor setup just keep in mind that its just igp accelerated.

Some fun thing is that i can drag Dota2 (vulkan) from external egpu to internal screen, it works fine. Fps goes from 80ish to 30ish but the miracle is there because hd3000 does not support vulkan and you never get 30fps on high seting with this igp. Afterburner reports no clockrates and egpu usage if i disable the external monitor but the game still runs so its weird but performance wise i think amd or win10 doing something in the background.

If you not connect an external monitor it forces igp, probably the windowed thing done some work when dragging around the monitors.

 

Edited by Doink

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