Moderator angerthosenear Posted January 18, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 18, 2014 Quick test to see if there is any difference between the PE4L-EC060 and the PE4L-PM060Essentially. ExpressCard vs mPCIeI7-2620M2x 8,192 MB G.Skill DDR3 @ 667 MHzdGPU disabledAMD Radeon R9 280XWindows 8.1 EnterpriseFan mod (full fan speed) active to reduce throttling (due to poor Fujitsu design)Running 3DMark11EC:AMD Radeon R9 280X video card benchmark result - Intel Core i7-2620M Processor,FUJITSU FJNB231P70189474/3962/3929mPCIe:(testing now after I post and pull laptop apart)//////// And of course. It's just not plug and play happiness. Fujitsu claims there is no whitelist. But computer won't boot with it plugged in. Not sure what's going on.Attempted on a Dell Studio 1737, got BSODs after driver installs. It didn't even work with hotplugging. Oh well.Now testing on a Dell Latitude E6420 (thanks boss for letting borrow your personal laptop for testing!):i7-2620M8GB RAMR9 280XWindows 8EC:http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/7842335P64448121/3981/3977EC (Re-ran with back panel off):http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/7842928P64528147/3972/3977mPCIe (note, back panel off, not sure if there would be a difference due to thermal / airflow):http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/7842830P70269468/3967/3954Side note: the Dell Latitude E6420 is a very nice laptop. Has two true mPCIe slots and 1 USB-based mPCIe slot. Easily upgradable. Single HDD bay however, no mSATA that I see. Nice fan. Thin and light, yet solid. *hides in bag*Not sure if an issue with the first test or something, but the mPCIe test is significantly better. But yet only matches the EC test on my laptop. So perhaps... "It depends" would be the best we can say.Conclusion:It more than likely doesn't make a difference what interface is used. Just variables when testing gave some varying results. Not really a surprise here since both are PCIe 1x connections. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapytopy Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Get the PE4L. I would recommend PE4l + geforce 660Ti for for best performance. Something like a corsair 430 would be good for a PSU. Not sure if you will need setup 1.x. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buhnanafone Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Get the PE4L. I would recommend PE4l + geforce 660Ti for for best performance. Something like a corsair 430 would be good for a PSU. Not sure if you will need setup 1.x.Great, so with the new PE4L i will get 5gbps~ , right?!! There's one thing i am confused about the pcie x1/x4/x16 connectors mentioned by nando. he said that they are restricted? What did he mean? Do I have to do any special setup for that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Inferno Fan Posted January 18, 2014 Author Share Posted January 18, 2014 Great, so with the new PE4L i will get 5gbps~ , right?!! There's one thing i am confused about the pcie x1/x4/x16 connectors mentioned by nando. he said that they are restricted? What did he mean? Do I have to do any special setup for that?Recommend a PE4L 2.1b or PE4H 3.2, both using a soldered cable which are Gen2 (5Gbps) capable. PE4L 2.1b is an open-ended x1 slot that can accomdate a x16 card. For a XPS 15 L502X you'll also need Setup 1.x to coordinate eGPU detection on the mPCIe slot, disable the dGPU to gain x1.2Opt performance and internal LCD mode as well as for PCI compaction to allocate the eGPU so as to eradicate error 12. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudeone Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 So do I understand this list correctly and every notebook on this list is compatible but with some it is more complicated to establish an eGPU connection? Because I find the list a little bit confusing. Thinking about getting a MBP from MID 2012, so this is why I'm asking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Inferno Fan Posted January 19, 2014 Author Share Posted January 19, 2014 So do I understand this list correctly and every notebook on this list is compatible but with some it is more complicated to establish an eGPU connection? Because I find the list a little bit confusing. Thinking about getting a MBP from MID 2012, so this is why I'm asking...This DIY eGPU forum now has the tools (Setup 1.x, DSDT override/substitution) to make over 98% of notebooks be able to host an eGPU. This differs to commercial vendors such Villagetronic, Magma, Sonnet that offer pricier hardware but for whatever reason were not technically capable of developing similar tools to solve eGPU issues (error 12, 43, performance issues).The candidate list presents systems that have Thunderbolt or expresscard slots for more convenient eGPU implementations. A sprinkling of mPCIe systems are included with links to convenient implementations using that harder to access slot. The technical intricies of setting this up per system mostly depends on how well the factory bios/firmware deals with a detected eGPU on bootup, how it set the TOLUD (pci-e config space start address), whether there is a bios facility to disable any dGPU the system may have and how well the bios configures underlying bridges. Some systems are completely plug-and-play.We have a list of implementations with per-system configuration details here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sompom Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 //////// And of course. It's just not plug and play happiness. Fujitsu claims there is no whitelist. But computer won't boot with it plugged in. Not sure what's going on.Can I pick your brain for a second?I don't know much about whitelists, but I know that the HP I have wouldn't accept a new Intel WiFi card, so I installed a non-whitelist BIOS, and now the WiFi card works. My laptop doesn't boot with the eGPU in either. Would you think that this is a problem with the whitelist still?My computer does boot with the SW1 switch set to anything other than 1. Is that equivalent to having it plugged in before switching the laptop on? (Needless to say, I have never yet seen my eGPU in the OS)From my readings on PCI, this whole system should be hot-pluggable. Just flip the laptop over while running, yank out the WiFi card and stick in the eGPU. Does that work for anybody? (Hotplugging my wifi card alone works) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator angerthosenear Posted January 19, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 19, 2014 Can I pick your brain for a second?I don't know much about whitelists, but I know that the HP I have wouldn't accept a new Intel WiFi card, so I installed a non-whitelist BIOS, and now the WiFi card works. My laptop doesn't boot with the eGPU in either. Would you think that this is a problem with the whitelist still?My computer does boot with the SW1 switch set to anything other than 1. Is that equivalent to having it plugged in before switching the laptop on? (Needless to say, I have never yet seen my eGPU in the OS)From my readings on PCI, this whole system should be hot-pluggable. Just flip the laptop over while running, yank out the WiFi card and stick in the eGPU. Does that work for anybody? (Hotplugging my wifi card alone works)I'd rather keep my brain securely located within my skull.You may have a whitelist issue. But if you are using a custom BIOS to remove the whitelist, then the issue is something else. Not exactly sure on how to fix.What laptop do you have? There might be someone else with the same model as you that got an eGPU setup working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relentless Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 It looks like both Magma and Sonnet have now officially released their Thunderbolt 2.0 'upgraded' boxes:Sonnet PR - Sonnet Now Shipping Thunderbolt 2 Expansion ChassisMagma to Release ThunderboltInterestingly, Magma have specified a $99 upgrade cost for older consumers... if that continued then an investment of $1k in a Magma box is not so bad if you get future Thunderbolt upgrades for only $100.Still expensive ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Inferno Fan Posted January 20, 2014 Author Share Posted January 20, 2014 The Echo Express III-D (part number ECHO-EXP3F-D) has a suggested retail price of $979. The Echo Express III-R (part number ECHO-EXP3F-R) has a suggested retail price of $1,199. The Echo Express III-R Mobile Rack Kit (part number ECHO-EXP3F-R-MR) has a suggested retail price of $199. The Echo Express SE II (part number ECHO-EXP-SE2) has a suggested retail price of $499. Low price/performance ratio. Can't see gamers replacing their gaming desktop with one of these. Handy as it also ensures Intel's core CPU business isn't intruded upon by pluggable CUDA/OpenCL eGPU processing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sompom Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 I'd rather keep my brain securely located within my skull. Too bad. Your brain is mine now What laptop do you have? There might be someone else with the same model as you that got an eGPU setup working. I have an HP-TM2 2151nr. As far as I can find, nobody has done an HP-TM2. Quite likely there are people who have done similar laptops, but I don't know what a "similar" laptop to this one would be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relentless Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 There are two other Thunderbolt options:This 10Gbps Thunderbolt to PCIe adapter for $200 - which may be as close as we will get to the TH05.It also looks like OWC are releasing the Sonnet Echo Express SE II rebranded (again) under their Helios name at $480.We need a nice plug and play external power brick with plugs for a high power graphics card to help use both these products. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Inferno Fan Posted January 20, 2014 Author Share Posted January 20, 2014 There are two other Thunderbolt options:This 10Gbps Thunderbolt to PCIe adapter for $200 - which may be as close as we will get to the TH05.It also looks like OWC are releasing the Sonnet Echo Express SE II rebranded (again) under their Helios name at $480.We need a nice plug and play external power brick with plugs for a high power graphics card to help use both these products.Good find with the firmtek product. Did a little more research on their website : FirmTek ThunderTek/PX-Q6G Specifications finding (1) it comes with a 36W AC adapter and (2) the DIP switches are for fan control - there is no PCI Reset Delay. So for eGPU use the AC adapter would need to be replaced with a 75W model to power the slot. Would also need a PCI extender cable to get a x16 slot from the x4 one. The same cable allowing to mod in a PCI Reset Delay if using it with a Macbook as described at http://forum.techinferno.com/diy-e-gpu-projects/4570-%5Bguide%5D-2012-13-rmbp-gtx660-sonnet-echo-express-se-%40-10gbps.html . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobsson Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 Good find with the firmtek product. Did a little more research on their website : FirmTek ThunderTek/PX-Q6G Specifications finding (1) it comes with a 36W AC adapter and (2) the DIP switches are for fan control - there is no PCI Reset Delay. So for eGPU use the AC adapter would need to be replaced with a 75W model to power the slot. Would also need a PCI extender cable to get a x16 slot from the x4 one. The same cable allowing to mod in a PCI Reset Delay if using it with a Macbook as described at http://forum.techinferno.com/diy-e-gpu-projects/4570-%5Bguide%5D-2012-13-rmbp-gtx660-sonnet-echo-express-se-%40-10gbps.html .Hmm this sounds like a cool project! For power one could possibly add a 8-pin pci-e female connector to use a 220w Dell D220P, solder some cables for splitting the 3 x 12v lanes inside the case (one for the board and two for the GPU).I'm pitching this for my friend that recently bought a late 2013 macbook pro, let's hope he bites =) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymacy Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 heyhey guys..today i recieved my PE4L 2.1b.. 1. i connected it to the PSU with the floppy cable.. 2. then i connected the "mainboard card" to the PSU.. 3. then i connected my gtx 760 to the PE4L 2.1b4. i conneced the GPU to the correct PSU cables 4. i used the switch on one of the boards to power up.. gpu is running fine, a green LED lights up5. i plug in the expresscard.. but i doesnt get recognised (got a dell vostro 5630 and a fujitsu n532 here, neither detects the gpu).. on the PE4L a red LED lights up.6. i tried all variations of Laptop off EC card plugged in power up.. Hotplugging the EC while windows runs etc.i then plugged in an old laptop PSU to the PE4L in the AC Adapter, i switch on the PSU and my GPU Fans start to spin 100% (much faster then before).. i immeadetly unplug everything and now my GPU always runs the fans 100% and doesnt work anymore.. when i plug it in my desktop and to my monitor it doesnt give any signal.. the fans run 100% even when not connected to the PSU.. just plugging it to the PCIe slot.. seems broken :/ i hope this didnt void my warranty..however.. i think that my GPU is "broken" now was my own fault because of plugging in a laptop PSU but why didnt it work before?what does the red LED mean ? what else could be the cause? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobsson Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 heyhey guys..today i recieved my PE4L 2.1b.. 1. i connected it to the PSU with the floppy cable.. 2. then i connected the "mainboard card" to the PSU.. 3. then i connected my gtx 760 to the PE4L 2.1b4. i conneced the GPU to the correct PSU cables 4. i used the switch on one of the boards to power up.. gpu is running fine, a green LED lights up5. i plug in the expresscard.. but i doesnt get recognised (got a dell vostro 5630 and a fujitsu n532 here, neither detects the gpu).. on the PE4L a red LED lights up.6. i tried all variations of Laptop off EC card plugged in power up.. Hotplugging the EC while windows runs etc.i then plugged in an old laptop PSU to the PE4L in the AC Adapter, i switch on the PSU and my GPU Fans start to spin 100% (much faster then before).. i immeadetly unplug everything and now my GPU always runs the fans 100% and doesnt work anymore.. when i plug it in my desktop and to my monitor it doesnt give any signal.. the fans run 100% even when not connected to the PSU.. just plugging it to the PCIe slot.. seems broken :/ i hope this didnt void my warranty..however.. i think that my GPU is "broken" now was my own fault because of plugging in a laptop PSU but why didnt it work before?what does the red LED mean ? what else could be the cause?I can almost assure you that the GPU is not broken. Have you played around with the pci-reset delay on the PE4L? There are two switches: SW1/SW2! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymacy Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 thanks for the reply!no i havent tried that yet.. however right now i have no gpu to do this.. my gtx 760 doesnt work anymore.. not even in my desktop pc.. any idea how i can make it work again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobsson Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 thanks for the reply!no i havent tried that yet.. however right now i have no gpu to do this.. my gtx 760 doesnt work anymore.. not even in my desktop pc.. any idea how i can make it work again? Hmm, that's not good, I'm sorry for your loss I think you should return it for a new one since it now doesn't work in your desktop. The only thing I can come up with is that you should check that pci-e power pins are intact on top of the card. To be honest I think there is no problem returning the card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sskillz Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 thanks for the reply!no i havent tried that yet.. however right now i have no gpu to do this.. my gtx 760 doesnt work anymore.. not even in my desktop pc.. any idea how i can make it work again?My bet is that as long as you play dumb they'll replace it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillofoc Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 heyhey guys..today i recieved my PE4L 2.1b.. 1. i connected it to the PSU with the floppy cable.. 2. then i connected the "mainboard card" to the PSU.. 3. then i connected my gtx 760 to the PE4L 2.1b4. i conneced the GPU to the correct PSU cables 4. i used the switch on one of the boards to power up.. gpu is running fine, a green LED lights up5. i plug in the expresscard.. but i doesnt get recognised (got a dell vostro 5630 and a fujitsu n532 here, neither detects the gpu).. on the PE4L a red LED lights up.6. i tried all variations of Laptop off EC card plugged in power up.. Hotplugging the EC while windows runs etc.i then plugged in an old laptop PSU to the PE4L in the AC Adapter, i switch on the PSU and my GPU Fans start to spin 100% (much faster then before).. i immeadetly unplug everything and now my GPU always runs the fans 100% and doesnt work anymore.. when i plug it in my desktop and to my monitor it doesnt give any signal.. the fans run 100% even when not connected to the PSU.. just plugging it to the PCIe slot.. seems broken :/ i hope this didnt void my warranty..however.. i think that my GPU is "broken" now was my own fault because of plugging in a laptop PSU but why didnt it work before?what does the red LED mean ? what else could be the cause?Was it a 12V or 19V adapter? As I understand, a PE4L 2.1b takes only 12V. Do you have a backup video card around? I found a GT610 for 10 bucks on Newegg and use it as my backup. Also, try a sleep, power on gpu, plug in EC, wake up laptop. If you get errors then you might need a DSDT override. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymacy Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 hey guys.. thanks for the replies.. my gtx 760 seems to be fried.. but the support was very nice and they said i will get a replacement.. and yeah i played dumb i will get a new gpu tommorow.. now i tried to check if the TOLUD is enough on my fujitsu N532.. i did a "all" compaction in 1.3x Setup.. but i then am stuck at Press ENTER to return to menu... "[statwin] Gathering system details to create Status Window"... any idea whats wrong there? i am using Setup 1.3x on a USB Stick as i couldnt get it to work otherwise.. thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobsson Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 hey guys.. thanks for the replies..my gtx 760 seems to be fried.. but the support was very nice and they said i will get a replacement.. and yeah i played dumb i will get a new gpu tommorow.. now i tried to check if the TOLUD is enough on my fujitsu N532.. i did a "all" compaction in 1.3x Setup.. but i then am stuck at Press ENTER to return to menu... "[statwin] Gathering system details to create Status Window"... any idea whats wrong there? i am using Setup 1.3x on a USB Stick as i couldnt get it to work otherwise.. thanks Good to hear dude! @Tech Inferno Fan should be able to answer most of the 'Setup 1.x'-questions. What does your TOLUD show? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymacy Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 UPDATE: ok guys its looking much better already.. with SW Switch on 2 or 3 i can get my N532 to recognise the gtx760.. however there are 2 problems left.. 1. as soon as i plug in the EC in windows(dgpu disabled).. my gtx760 gets recognised and win switches to it.. however my network adapters stop working / have problems.. 2. the card runs in 1.1 mode.. to fix this i tried to do a compaction.. but when i do a full compaction i get stuck in "back to enter menu".. when i do a compaction "ALL except SOUND, USB......" i get stuck in black screen after chainloading either mbr1 ,2 or bootmanager.. when i try to "show state" of Nvidia gpu´s in Setup 1.3x it says: NOTE : Unconfigured display adapter found, device not accessible: GK1xx NVidia display adapters present in system: <0> Geforce GT 620M and here is my status screen with deactivated dgpu: retraining ports to 2gen or 2x speed didnt change the fact that the egpu is running @1.1 either.. any help or tips greatly appreciated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobsson Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 UPDATE:ok guys its looking much better already.. with SW Switch on 2 or 3 i can get my N532 to recognise the gtx760..however there are 2 problems left..1. as soon as i plug in the EC in windows(dgpu disabled).. my gtx760 gets recognised and win switches to it.. however my network adapters stop working / have problems..2. the card runs in 1.1 mode..That's good news. 1: My network adapter gets re-allocated every time I connect my eGPU so it should be ok after couple of seconds. 2: 1.1 link mode is normal when eGPU is in link idle state. You should test stressing it by running a game (add it in your program-list in nvidia control panel -> set the game to use 'high performance graphics'), then TAB out and check GPU-z link state again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Inferno Fan Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 to fix this i tried to do a compaction.. but when i do a full compaction i get stuck in "back to enter menu".. when i do a compaction "ALL except SOUND, USB......" i get stuck in black screen after chainloading either mbr1 ,2 or bootmanager..Please highlight PCI compaction->Run compact, then hit F1 for help. It will list over 20 different compaction configurations to try until you get one that provides a freeze-free solution that also allows Chainloading. You should ensure you get a Chainloading configuration that works prior to doing any PCI compaction. Usually that will be Chainloader->mode.mbr.Jacobsson has provided advice about the x1.1 link speed. That is what will remain in DOS mode. Confirm you are running a Gen2 link once you are in Windows, the eGPU is working with no error12/34/etc, you can run a background task that uses the eGPU and then run GPU-Z to check link speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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