Founder Brian Posted March 20, 2012 Founder Share Posted March 20, 2012 Check this out: Mobility and Sleek Design Without Sacrifice - Asetek, Inc. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founder StamatisX Posted March 20, 2012 Founder Share Posted March 20, 2012 ok that's really cool... how much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
widezu69 Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 One of those SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY! moments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svl7 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Looks really neat, but the pump will definitely kill battery life when on the move. What I really wonder about is how exactly the pipes are connected to the radiators and cooling blocks... any idea? It doesn't really look as if it could be disassembled, for me it seems as if the whole system is one piece, so repasting and other service task on the hardware side would be a big PITA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founder Brian Posted March 21, 2012 Author Founder Share Posted March 21, 2012 From first appearance it looks like the whole thing is interconnected and would require it to be removed in order to pull a video card out. I honestly have no problem with that if it came to it because increased cooling capacity far outweighs the other cons. Thus far I have never upgraded my video card, I simply sell the notebook and move on to a newer one. So if it limits or makes upgrading GPUs tougher, I don't really mind. MXM will still be there and those that are technically adept will be able to perform the upgrades while the noobs will have to rely on techs or a new notebook--that's how it should be. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svl7 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Hahaha, I see. Nice points, lol. But still, repasting with such a cooling system is hard. I already repasted notebooks which had one cooler which connected both dies (GPU and CPU) with one heatpipe, and it's way easier to mess up. Now with three it would be pretty difficult to fix the screws evenly. And changing the GPUs could for example mess up the CPU cooling, if the GPU die of the new card is slightly higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founder Brian Posted March 21, 2012 Author Founder Share Posted March 21, 2012 Hahaha, I see. Nice points, lol. But still, repasting with such a cooling system is hard. I already repasted notebooks which had one cooler which connected both dies (GPU and CPU) with one heatpipe, and it's way easier to mess up. Now with three it would be pretty difficult to fix the screws evenly. And changing the GPUs could for example mess up the CPU cooling, if the GPU die of the new card is slightly higher.True it would be tougher but in this case I'd hope repasting wouldn't be necessary given the superior cooling. Dell's own paste is pretty good as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svl7 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 It really looks sweet And I guess it really is one piece... I wonder where they leech the power required to run the pump... probably from the HDD power circuits. Shouldn't be a problem, especially when using SSDs. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
widezu69 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 From looking at the pictures, it looks like the pump is sitting in the battery compartment. The batter would have to be redesigned or removed completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svl7 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Hmm, afaik the current AW systems aren't designed to be run without battery, that's also a reason why it's harder to remove it. If I'm not mistaken then the battery also serves as protection against voltage fluctuations. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Love the idea. "These clocks could not be run on standard air cooling" Except we know better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unreal25 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Well I really love the idea, if it can be made to work with the battery. I am more interested in how quiet will laptop run at these clocks. Also, as svl7 there was no mention of how it affects the battery life (if the battery is still there). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founder StamatisX Posted March 21, 2012 Founder Share Posted March 21, 2012 When on battery you can't run everything at full speed anyways... so the heat produced won't be that much in order for the pump to be constantly working... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evgasr2 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 (edited) Looks nice, Im thinking of watercooling my G73.but a guy did , but it was unsucessful.Here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epvBpe9B2yU Edited March 21, 2012 by evgasr2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninjahunter Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Imagine, M14x that isnt comparable to a vacuum of doom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff Sargent Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 so it wouldn't be safe for me to run my M17x R3 plug in and battery removed? I used to do just that on an older machine I had since the battery had a port for charging outside the laptop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mw86 Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) Nice implementation of watercooling... Im impressed. I like the above could be interested in such a cooling system. Why did they not show temps stock heatsinks @ stock and overclock then watercooled @ stock and overclock? Can we find that data? Is it actually cooler at those speeds and less noise or is it just less noise and temps are comparable to stock heatsink? What if stock heatsinks were interconnected? Its already been discussed last year in M18x Gpu and Cpu cooling discussion. The data about temp difference should be a important part too... Id love to see this marketed but still would like to see more performance comparisons and more data. Top notch implementation though. Great article @Brian Edit: what about warranty can these be installed by dell to keep it official or will these strictly be DIY and whats a warranty good for anyway theory?Edit 2: I just want to say as a general range when someone has repasted and ensured good contact etc on stock heatsinks GPU AMD 6970m's or 6990M's that clocking to 800mhz on those apps wont give crazy temps either on stock heatsinks. Ive seen enough users at nice temps in that range. We know like Jimbo is getting at we can easily pass those tests even gpu wise at those clocks. Raise your mem and its likely to see a even larger increase in temps... so key points are important for comparison. 76c was hottest temp on fans on gpu @ 822 core 1100mhz mem on 6970m xfire after repaste when i left the system in game for hours on Skyrim and BF3 and others... if i left mem stock temps would be lower than that 76c it was nearly 12 -18 hours on a desk with proper ventilation (a lift) in a hot room no room conditioning. In those benches it didnt break 70c ever. 6990m has more shader but surely 800mhz would be similar to heat from the 6970m at 822mhz and 1100mem... so is the benefit of a quiet system the only real benefit or is there large gains in the cooling of these components. We all know as the discussion last year there would be some sort of benefit uniting all three heatsinks to help disperse heat... does implementing liquid cooling add a further benefit to the temps at such a scale or does the real benefits show on only the bigger brother desktop cooling solutions only? Edited March 23, 2012 by mw86 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svl7 Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Yeah, it kinda bothers me that they didn't show any temps for their prototype... I mean if they aren't distinctly lower it doesn't make any sense to put such a cooling system in a notebook. And the pipes seem to have a really small diameter, so I have some doubts regarding the cooling capability. Still, it does look great Anyway, what I want to say is that the M18x seems to have a great cooling system, at least from what I can tell reading the reports and seeing pictures... three heatpipes per GPU are pretty good, and each die that needs cooling (2x GPU, 1xCPU) has it's own radiator. Heatpipes have an incredibly low thermal resistance and a great thermal conductivity, far better than copper for example. Thus I kinda doubt that the presented water cooling system is clearly superior to the M18x stock cooling. The only advantage I can see is that all three radiators are connected to the circuit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mw86 Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Yeah, it kinda bothers me that they didn't show any temps for their prototype... I mean if they aren't distinctly lower it doesn't make any sense to put such a cooling system in a notebook. And the pipes seem to have a really small diameter, so I have some doubts regarding the cooling capability. Still, it does look great Anyway, what I want to say is that the M18x seems to have a great cooling system, at least from what I can tell reading the reports and seeing pictures... three heatpipes per GPU are pretty good, and each die that needs cooling (2x GPU, 1xCPU) has it's own radiator. Heatpipes have an incredibly low thermal resistance and a great thermal conductivity, far better than copper for example. Thus I kinda doubt that the presented water cooling system is clearly superior to the M18x stock cooling. The only advantage I can see is that all three radiators are connected to the circuit. My thoughts exactly my friend. I question the presented data; i love the theory but want to see some cold hard data on it as you said i feel same way why bother unless temps are in fact better. I am i have to admit hopeful that they are better and not just from the fact they are interconnected... Because we could easily see such a mod for non liquid M18x cooling... as mentioned i hope to see real data as the idea is a grreat one that i have much respect for. The cpu could always use more cooling but like you said SVL7 3 heat pipes is pretty optimal for these gpus and next gen is supposed to use equal or less watts and heat... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 I think Alienware actually overspecced the coolers on the GPUs, If you sacrificed say 10% of each GPU cooler and increased the capacity of the CPU cooler by 20% that would be a faster system overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founder Brian Posted March 24, 2012 Author Founder Share Posted March 24, 2012 I think Alienware actually overspecced the coolers on the GPUs, If you sacrificed say 10% of each GPU cooler and increased the capacity of the CPU cooler by 20% that would be a faster system overall.Actually they didn't and I'll tell you why. Dell strictly adheres to thermal limits set by the MXM standard and because of that, the 580M is meant to throttle once it reaches some arbitrary TDP (way below 100W). After that point, it throttles even more. Initially this was a big problem with the 580M until Dell pushed the ceiling on the TDP since they were operating below MXM standards and because the generous cooling setup for the M18x allowed it. Now if you look at the M17x-R3 on the other hand, their cooling isn't much worse than ours but because of a combination of inferior cooling + less tolerance in the MXM circuitry, they are stuck with a 78C throttle limit which sucks. If we had lesser cooling, there's no doubt we'd be screwed as well. I really wish Clevo would step it up with better designs because I really like the way they do things. While they don't support overclocking via bios like Dell, everything else is just done way better. From cooling to not being overly strict with TDP limitations which end up just crippling a system. The M17x-R3 + 580M/675M is a crippled system because of Dell's lack of foresight. Anyway I've gone way off tangent but the point is, be glad we have abundant GPU cooling. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 Actually they didn't and I'll tell you why. Dell strictly adheres to thermal limits set by the MXM standard and because of that, the 580M is meant to throttle once it reaches some arbitrary TDP (way below 100W). After that point, it throttles even more. Initially this was a big problem with the 580M until Dell pushed the ceiling on the TDP since they were operating below MXM standards and because the generous cooling setup for the M18x allowed it. Fair enough, never heard it explained that fully. So if I'm understanding this they could be a little looser with the MXM standards and it would cease being a problem? I just feel like the CPU cooling is more inadequate than the GPU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mw86 Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) I just feel like the CPU cooling is more inadequate than the GPU. The cpu cooling is adequate for realistic mobile speeds but yes perhaps the triple pipe heatsink in early models on the cpu could of been very formidable. There is plenty of room for improvements though on the standard XM cooling on M18x CPU. So something like this liquid cooling system is a good idea if it can take more heat than the standard heat pipes. Looking forward to see more of it. The cpu standard could take some pointers from MXM and maybe we would see more push of the field in the cpu cooling industry M17x R2 is only held back by same issue... those 920/940xm can easily go higher given a better heatsink put a 900xm in a similar cooling system as the m18x or this Asetek innovation and they would be blazing since they could handle full voltage and not throttle from heat issues. i hope all the pc companies use much stricter higher standards on their cooling... And look to innovate like Asestek or buy from innovative companies like them. Jimbo in ways these cpus are held back the tecnology is more capable then the cooling systems are. Hopefully these innovations prove to be very helpful as even in 900xm series they are held back only by the cpu heatsink... im sure R2 owners will say their gpu cooling was more adequate than cpu. Any word on price? Edited March 24, 2012 by mw86 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mw86 Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 One of those SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY! moments.Well sort of seriously how much? Loland does dell install or would having one be warranty void? Will it be sold for M18x R1 or is this concept only going to be for future models? What cooling is M18x r2 planned for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iPhantomhive Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 mini air conditioner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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