Strange issue with P180HM/X8100 6970M Crossfire.

[gamer]

Hello everyone. I am glad to be posting in the T|I forums as I believe this page is FULL of knowledge. So I'm going to throw this at you so you can let me know your opinions and if possible get some help on this strange issue.

And the question is...

Is it possible for an SSD to alter certain behaviors of a computer such as conflicting with drivers?

Now I will explain...

[system specs:

Eurocom P180HM Leopard 2.0 (BIOS date 9/29/11)

Core i7 2630QM

Dual Radeon HD 6970M in Crossfire

Dual Seagate 750GB (sometimes in RAID, explained below)

OCZ Vertex 2 50GB/Crucial M4 128GB (also explained below)

8GB RAM

Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit]

I recently got my Clevo P180HM / Eurocom Leopard 2.0 (to make it clear... the Sandy Bridge 18.4in dual GPU monster with the piano finish we all abhor)

So when my Eurocom came into my house the first thing I wanted to do was stress it and test each and every function of it to be sure I got a good system. And to do that I first added the 3rd hard drive onto it. I installed my (at the moment) good ol' OCZ Vertex 2 50GB. Added OS, and then al the needed drivers. It was a breeze. ALL of the drivers installed correctly with no problem or corruption whatsoever, including the recently released Radeon 11.11 Drivers. Then I added Windows updates. And finally I went ahead and stressed the system to be sure everything worked fine. Ran Crysis for like half an hour on maxed out settings (truly maxed out) with no problem at all. Then I ran Unigine Heaven Benchmark, as I consider it an amazing benchamrk for testing system stability too. I did 5 passes and it didn't break a sweat. Then I ran MSI Kombustor, twice, and again, no errors at all. Rock solid stability.

So I decided to go ahead and give the lil' beasts a nice overclock. Adding 120MHz to the 6970Ms was as easy as it gets with Sapphire Trixx, being able to run them @ 800MHz testing them in the same way as before (around half an hour of Crysis, two passes of MSI Kombustor and 5 Unigine Heaven passes. ROCK SOLID. NO issues whatsoever. It was the dream system, I couldn't ask for more... until...

I tried recovering from Hibernation, which is the state in which I keep my computer every time I go to sleep, only to discover that my Vertex 2 had the damn SandForce bug, which by the moment was ignored by me, so I did some research to find out what happened and learned about the SandForce bug. Then rushed to the local hardware store and got a good replacement for the drive which was about to fail. I bought a Crucial M4, which I am using at the moment because when I got home the computer had run out of battery and my OCZ Vertex was gone. I tried booting only to make a clone of my drive but was unable to do it. My OCZ is gone for good.

So I then skipped 4 of the 5 stages of mourn and accepted it, and with a Marvell-ous M4 in my hand and a rock solid system I thought I had nothing to fear... I mean, it was only a matter of reinstalling everything right?

No.

Already long story short:

The ONLY change made to my computer was the SSD, but now things are VERY different with my system.

I was unable to install 11.11 drivers for the 6970M Crosfire, because every time I install them, naturally it has to reboot, so when coming back to Windows witht the drivers now installed I get a atikmdag.sys BSOD before being able to log into windows. The only thing I am able to do is go to safe mode, but I can't uninstall from there, so I have to make use of Windows recovery to let it uninstall the drivers and then clean with Driver Sweeper.

Fine... no 11.11?? Well, I got it to work properly with 11.10... but my overclocks cannot even reach the 730MHz!? (Currently running both @ 700MHz... miserable 20MHz OC when I know these are capable of MUCH more) This is absurd considering how solid it was before, and running at 800MHz!

Not only that. I cannot make RAID volumes anymore...

So, is it possible for the drive to interfere SO much as to cause this issues? As I said, it is the ONLY hardware change made to the system.

I already tested the drive enough to know it is not faulty, and even checked it with the Windows utility and no errors or damages are found.

The last thing I want to say is that actually the system is quite solid in its current state... but I want better OverClocks! AND my RAID!

About RAID, I think I can make it work if I install Intel Rapid Storage thing... it actually enabled the system to RAID last time I tried. What I am really concerned about it the OC.

But well, what do you guys think? Strange isn't it? I was thinking on a Firmware update to my Crucial to see if that makes the trick. Maybe even updating the BIOS? Maybe editing the 6970Ms BIOS? Well, I don't know what to do. Maybe even overvolting, but I don't see the need of such tewak if they were running amazingly good before, and even OC'd they were ROCK SOLID.

This all points to a Driver related issue, but how come the drivers install properly on one SSD and not as well on the other one????

All help will be appreciated.

Thanks in advance!

Edited November 26, 2011 by gamer

[StamatisX]

Hello gamer and welcome to T|I!

Wanted to ask you if you made clear Windows installation (everything from scratch) or you used a restoration disk. Also in case you had a clean Windows installation, did you make sure you installed the drivers in the proper order? i.e you can't install the GPU drivers before the chipset drivers.

[gamer]

Thanks for the welcome StamatisX! And thanks for providing help on the topic.

Yes, installations are as clean as it gets... In fact the GPU drivers were the last ones to be installed... the install order is something like this:

Chipset

Ethernet

Card Reader

USB 3.0

Hotkey (to control volume, screen brightness, Wireless card switch, etc)

Gamekey (to add macros to the 8 G keys to the side of the keyboard)

Mouse

Wireless Killer drivers

GPU...

Or something like that... I think if it isn't the ideal order, I think at least it gets pretty close.

There were 2 things that I refused to install, but I guess they cannot be the conflicting foce. They are Intel Rapid Storage and the other one was Intel Management Engine something, which ended up being installed through Windows Updates.

What would be an ideal order?

[StamatisX]

I would install them in the following order:

1)Chipset

2)Card Reader

3)USB 3? (why is there a need for a separate installation?)

4)Hotkeys/Gamekeys

5)Storage Drivers

6)Ethernet

7)WiFi

8)GPU

[Brian]

The lack of overclocking of the GPUs shouldn't have any relation to the HDD. When you overclock passed 20 MHz on the GPU, what happens? Does it lock up or BSOD with a message?

[mw86]

http://forum.techinferno.com/general-notebook-discussions/1322-amd-catalysts-8-93-november-18th-release.html#post16051

"btw to fix bsod loop >boot safe mode> go to device manage/display driver... uninstall second card if crossfire, then hit uninstall on first card but this time select check box for "delete driver files" > go into C: and delete ATI/AMD folders from > x86Programfiles/common files> x86Program files>program files> C:AMD/> then use CCleaner and use the registry cleaner twice... yes twice... the driversweeper and say yes to restart and delete remaining entries. Now windows boots go and do one more registry clean with ccleaner and driversweeper... till nothing amd/ati shows up anymore."

11.11 was prone to bsod and super early leak of 11.12 as i posted... always the same bsod on reboot... use the driver brian posted in OP. Use my method above when in bsod on boot safe mode removal does work dont uninstall delete all folders and files ATI>uninstall GPUs in device manager> run registry cleaner and driversweeper. like i posted.

THen load those 8.93 drivers >11.12beta version 2 i posted pics of driver versions and which ones fail

Brian is right SSD no effect on GPU overclock.... driver issue = bad overclock

ulps is PTA btw if disabled and updating driver... the settings must be re-enabled after reinstall.... so just check to be sure if using ulps off... i tend to re-enable uninstall driver>update> disable ulps again... same goes for if i flash a modded vbios to set overclock without software

@gamer

Edited November 27, 2011 by mw86

[gamer]

I would install them in the following order:

1)Chipset

2)Card Reader

3)USB 3? (why is there a need for a separate installation?)

4)Hotkeys/Gamekeys

5)Storage Drivers

6)Ethernet

7)WiFi

8)GPU

Thanks, I guess I'll try that order.

I don't know why USB 3.0 must be installed separately, but the two ports won't work without it. It's the Renesas USB 3.0 Drivers.

I don't remember the order in which I installed to my old SSD, but I guess it's worth a try.

Thanks!

Added after 5 minutes:

The lack of overclocking of the GPUs shouldn't have any relation to the HDD. When you overclock passed 20 MHz on the GPU, what happens? Does it lock up or BSOD with a message?

Yeah, completely agree.... beats me... it's the strangest thing I've experimented...

About OC. With OCZ Verex 2 50GB (the now dead drive), using 11.11 drivers I was able to push, stress and test them both running @ 800MHz core clock and 1000 on memory.

Now with Crucial M4 (11.11 drivers will crash, so I have to use 11.10 instead) I tried 800... and it runs, but crashes with BSOD after a few minutes (1 or 2) then I went lower and tried 750 only to get the same BSOD. Currently running @ 700, stable and tested.

(sorry if my answer isn't very short, but I wanted to clarify)

Edited November 27, 2011 by gamer

[gamer]

The lack of overclocking of the GPUs shouldn't have any relation to the HDD. When you overclock passed 20 MHz on the GPU, what happens? Does it lock up or BSOD with a message?

BTW when BSOD appears while using 11.11 drivers (only with M4, Vertex 2 didn't have that issue) it is a headache as when it reboots and tries to reload the system it won't allow me to move the cursor while on the menu. So I cannot chose to, for example, Restore to an earlier point. I have to use the Windows installation DVD and run it from there.

[Brian]

BTW when BSOD appears while using 11.11 drivers (only with M4, Vertex 2 didn't have that issue) it is a headache as when it reboots and tries to reload the system it won't allow me to move the cursor while on the menu. So I cannot chose to, for example, Restore to an earlier point. I have to use the Windows installation DVD and run it from there.

Try switching to the 8.93 driver, you can find it here.

[gamer]

http://forum.techinferno.com/general-notebook-discussions/1322-amd-catalysts-8-93-november-18th-release.html#post16051

"btw to fix bsod loop >boot safe mode> go to device manage/display driver... uninstall second card if crossfire, then hit uninstall on first card but this time select check box for "delete driver files" > go into C: and delete ATI/AMD folders from > x86Programfiles/common files> x86Program files>program files> C:AMD/> then use CCleaner and use the registry cleaner twice... yes twice... the driversweeper and say yes to restart and delete remaining entries. Now windows boots go and do one more registry clean with ccleaner and driversweeper... till nothing amd/ati shows up anymore."

11.11 was prone to bsod and super early leak of 11.12 as i posted... always the same bsod on reboot... use the driver brian posted in OP. Use my method above when in bsod on boot safe mode removal does work dont uninstall delete all folders and files ATI>uninstall GPUs in device manager> run registry cleaner and driversweeper. like i posted.

THen load those 8.93 drivers >11.12beta version 2 i posted pics of driver versions and which ones fail

Brian is right SSD no effect on GPU overclock.... driver issue = bad overclock

ulps is PTA btw if disabled and updating driver... the settings must be re-enabled after reinstall.... so just check to be sure if using ulps off... i tend to re-enable uninstall driver>update> disable ulps again... same goes for if i flash a modded vbios to set overclock without software

@gamer

Amazing! Thanks for the condensed tutorial, I will try and follow it to see if thi solves the issue. I really, really want my nice 800MHz OverClock, or mabe more

What really got my mind spinning is why was I able to run 11.11 and do such a nice Overclock, being such bad drivers... and then, things changed ONLY by changing the SSD.

I noticed ticking ULPS on TRIXX is a little bit buggy, as it showed prompted me to disable it when it was already disabled so I had to restart to make the already made change. What you say is, if this was the issue (ULPS) I should try to uninstall (with both CCLeaner and DriverSweeper) reinstall drivers and again disable ULPS?

I hope the tutorial works as good as on your Alienware.

Added after 2 minutes:

Try switching to the 8.93 driver, you can find it here.

Thanks! I will try! Do you think they will be able to give the proper stability for good overclocks?

Could you please paste the link again? it shows me a screen with "Invalid Category ID"

thanks!

Edited November 27, 2011 by gamer

[Brian]

Ok sorry try this link and let me know if it works: http://forum.techinferno.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=15

[gamer]

Ok sorry try this link and let me know if it works: http://forum.techinferno.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=15

Odd. I get the same error, I can't access the file o_O is it in the Downloads Section?

[Brian]

Try again there was a permission error.

[gamer]

Amazing! Thanks!

[mw86]

Everything should work now on those drivers. Follow that thread you won't need to install CAP seperate its included in the driver.

When changing the ulps in trixx for just the use of setting ulps on or off you need to start trixx at start up via its own option. When windows restarts the registry gets set... So flip off or on but restart with start trixx at start up checked. Or the effects don't seem to apply. I think a scenario that would explain why 11.11 worked for you first time was if you had updated from an earlier version and not uninstalled sometimes the software is updated but the driver update doesn't because the driver like in device manager might have been on the older version still if it wasn't uninstalled before installing the new driver. I did that on purpose actually before what i call 11.12 beta version 2 (8.93) came out. 11.10 driver is only newest one that worked for me before 8.93 without bsod at boot... I booted without hwinfo and ulps in different settings... Stock clocks the driver when actually installed 11.11 (not the catalyst software version) would bsod on boot no matter what so until 11.12version 2 8.93 Brian posted... I installed 11.10 drivers and updated just the catalyst software and stuff to 11.12 version 1 beta... I posted pics of revision differences. The 11.12 beta 1 i had found and tried a week or two before 11.12a (8.92). I am seeing better performance in Battlefield 3 nothing in Skyrim on 8.93 over the 11.10 I had.

Currently on 822mhz core 1100mem set via vbios and no bsods good temps around 76max on stock volts but I keep fans on max all time at system start and repasted gpus from stock paste. Since I set those clocks in all power profiles in vbios it doesn't drop clocks once ulps is disabled again... But must be disabled first on reflashing of the vbios. Or second card won't show or shows 100 core.... I am currently working on 1.055v via vbios down from 1.1v stock volts. Flashing vbios is risky when not well caught up on the subject reading guides help and if done wrong can render a gpu a brick unless you plan to desolder a chip and reprogram the vbios reprogram via such a device to reprogram the chip. Svl7 wrote a guide hosted here on the main page about recovering a gpu from a bad flash. Going to low on volts renders it hard to work with to reflash. Either way you should be able to get a nice overclock on 8.93... But start low and work up after co.paring performance in a couple of games or benchmarks. Furmark won't show all overclock probe... Sometimes gpus down clock now or change handling internally when apps like furmark are used. If benching to get scores just use that app when raising the speeds to peak in that app but if setting speeds for gaming when cooling doesn't stay cool after hours you need to work up slow and test in the games you may have that when maxed out in graphic settings brings the framerate down low... And play them all awhile even better if you do it for quite awhile as gpus have chance to heat up and you will see really if your overclock is stable and worry free if temps stay low enough and no crashes occur after a few hours. (i posted a run for about 1day and 20 hours of Skyrim and Battlefield and Dirt3 stable on stock volts. Working on undervolt 1.06, 1.055 is lowest working for me so far at those clocks 1.05 gave trouble but i think it might have been a issue I had that i worked out. Still testing.

Edited November 27, 2011 by mw86

[gamer]

Everything should work now on those drivers. Follow that thread you won't need to install CAP seperate its included in the driver.

When changing the ulps in trixx for just the use of setting ulps on or off you need to start trixx at start up via its own option. When windows restarts the registry gets set... So flip off or on but restart with start trixx at start up checked. Or the effects don't seem to apply. I think a scenario that would explain why 11.11 worked for you first time was if you had updated from an earlier version and not uninstalled sometimes the software is updated but the driver update doesn't because the driver like in device manager might have been on the older version still if it wasn't uninstalled before installing the new driver. I did that on purpose actually before what i call 11.12 beta version 2 (8.93) came out. 11.10 driver is only newest one that worked for me before 8.93 without bsod at boot... I booted without hwinfo and ulps in different settings... Stock clocks the driver when actually installed 11.11 (not the catalyst software version) would bsod on boot no matter what so until 11.12version 2 8.93 Brian posted... I installed 11.10 drivers and updated just the catalyst software and stuff to 11.12 version 1 beta... I posted pics of revision differences. The 11.12 beta 1 i had found and tried a week or two before 11.12a (8.92). I am seeing better performance in Battlefield 3 nothing in Skyrim on 8.93 over the 11.10 I had.

Currently on 822mhz core 1100mem set via vbios and no bsods good temps around 76max on stock volts but I keep fans on max all time at system start and repasted gpus from stock paste. Since I set those clocks in all power profiles in vbios it doesn't drop clocks once ulps is disabled again... But must be disabled first on reflashing of the vbios. Or second card won't show or shows 100 core.... I am currently working on 1.055v via vbios down from 1.1v stock volts. Flashing vbios is risky when not well caught up on the subject reading guides help and if done wrong can render a gpu a brick unless you plan to desolder a chip and reprogram the vbios reprogram via such a device to reprogram the chip. Svl7 wrote a guide hosted here on the main page about recovering a gpu from a bad flash. Going to low on volts renders it hard to work with to reflash. Either way you should be able to get a nice overclock on 8.93... But start low and work up after co.paring performance in a couple of games or benchmarks. Furmark won't show all overclock probe... Sometimes gpus down clock now or change handling internally when apps like furmark are used. If benching to get scores just use that app when raising the speeds to peak in that app but if setting speeds for gaming when cooling doesn't stay cool after hours you need to work up slow and test in the games you may have that when maxed out in graphic settings brings the framerate down low... And play them all awhile even better if you do it for quite awhile as gpus have chance to heat up and you will see really if your overclock is stable and worry free if temps stay low enough and no crashes occur after a few hours. (i posted a run for about 1day and 20 hours of Skyrim and Battlefield and Dirt3 stable on stock volts. Working on undervolt 1.06, 1.055 is lowest working for me so far at those clocks 1.05 gave trouble but i think it might have been a issue I had that i worked out. Still testing.

I hope it works with those drivers. The job sent me out some days, sorry for the sooooo late reply and thanks!!! Now I am eager to try those drivers and see how it overclocks on them... BTW

Do you think it will be better than 11.11a 11.11b or 11.11c?? Those came out recently, do you guys think they are good at all?

Has anyone tried them so far??

Skyrim works amazing on this drivers even though the overclock isn't good at all... I run it with Crossfire and it runs amazingly good all maxed out. But I WANT MY OVERCLOCK!

Is it just me or are these cards amazing?? I mean pulling more than 100MHz out of a video card is always awesome... even though these are like underclocked 6850s the fact that you can not only achieve the desktop's card clocks but also surpass it makes me love them... if only drivers were not so mediocre... I hope they mature fast so AMD can get more fans on its side.

Thanks again!

[mw86]

Yes jump in to that 8.93 thread too... They really are worth going to over 11.11, 11.10 there are new features and paired with Radeon Pro a free Ati tweak app which automatically applies setting you manually override over default cc options allowing for finer tuning when needed and additional render options. These cards are by far very good for their price. They can over lock very nicely out of box. When you find the time we all would be glad to help you get the most out of your setup. Thank you yes for gaming clocks 822 core from a 680 stock card shows they can really be pushed even for real world use.